England Selectors

[Goughy]

Logically following on from the Aus thread, who should be the England selectors.

Currently there is a 4 man panel with Geoff Miller as Chairman, Coach Moores, Ashley Giles and James Whitaker.

Im not convinced that is the right combination.

Id set my own criteria.
a) The Chairman must have a substantial career and experience and the authority to justify the casting vote.
b) The coach should keep a position on the panel.
c) Selectors should be retired from International cricket for a min of 5 years and be divorced from friends, teammates and buddies.
d) There should be a effort toward continuity rather than repeated clean outs.
e) As many areas of expertise as possible should be covered.
f) All selectors should be English

My selections (and Im interested in other opinions and options) are-

Panel
Chairman- Angus Fraser (Test seam bowler, former cricket journo and new Middlesex Managing Director of Cricket)
1st- Alec Stewart (Surrey, Former England captain, batsman and wicketkeeper)
2nd- Mike Watkinson (Lancs, seamer, spinner, England Asst coach)
3rd- National Coach

and Id add an advisory panel of 3 people that would not have a vote but would always report their recommendations and opinions

Advisory Board
a) Neil Mallender (Test cricketer (seam bowler) and current circuit umpire)
b) Martyn Moxon (Test cricketer (opening batsman) and YCCC Director of Professional Cricket
c) Graeme Hick (Test cricketer (middle order and spin bowler) and recently retired record breaker)

 

[zaremba]

Interesting post.
I agree with your criteria.
The only thing on which I disagree is that personally I wouldn't want Watkinson anywhere near the England team, and I'm unconvinced by Fraser despite having had the pleasure (?) of listening to his views for some time on TMS now.

 

[PhoenixFire]

Not sure how you would stop the selectors from being friends with current test players.

 

[zaremba]

Not sure how you would stop the selectors from being friends with current test players.

It's ultimately impossible but you can reduce the risk / extent of such relationships by not choosing people who are still in the game, or very recently retired.

 

[fredfertang]

Involving current umpires is an excellent call

 

[Mr Mxyzptlk]

Not sure how you would stop the selectors from being friends with current test players.

Friendship isn't the issue. What I get from Kev's use of the term "buddies" is not so much the element of friendship, but the lack of objectivity due to that friendship. Once the selectors can maintain the professional and personal separation, friendship is fine.

 

[Richard]

Would agree with pretty much all Kev's criteria - I'd also add that the selectors themselves (not the advisory panel) should have no current positions with newspapers, TV or county clubs; and that they should have an established background dealing with people (it's vital that you're good at knowing how to let people down and to an extent even give them the good news) - but as for personnel, I'm just not sure.

Pretty well every journalist and commentator I've heard talk about England selection tends towards the exact same mistake-making that all appointed selectors of my time for England (and, let's emphasise, everywhere else as well) have continued to make, the two most common of which are:

• Over-emphasis on what a player might eventually be rather than what he is now when picking the Test side for now (I don't mind emphasis on what a player might one day be when picking A-teams, performance squads etc. and even to an extent the ODI side) and
• Mixing-up the First-Class and one-day (and now we're beginning to see Twenty20 as well) game-forms

Until these two basic errors are removed, selection will continue to be ridiculously muddled. We're better right now than we were in terms of giving players who are picked a decent run: for example, I disagreed vehemently with Ravinder Bopara being picked ahead of Owais Shah for the Tests in 2007/08, thought it was diabolical - but once you'd done it it'd have been even worse to reverse it. Bopara had to get the full series, and he did. He was then - rightly - dropped. But in 11 years I've seen absolutely no improvement in the two areas mentioned above and there's no indication it's going to happen any time soon either.

Until I see someone who can demonstrate the ability to get away from these (many here on CW.n do, but none in the media), I wouldn't have any faith in them as selectors. The same errors will continue to be repeated as long as the same bull**** stays in the system.

 

[Richard]

Friendship isn't the issue. What I get from Kev's use of the term "buddies" is not so much the element of friendship, but the lack of objectivity due to that friendship. Once the selectors can maintain the professional and personal separation, friendship is fine.

I'd go so far as to say that a friendly relationship between as many people as possible involved with the England (and any) team to whatever extent is very, very desireable.

 

[ozone]

Hmm, interesting post. Definately agree with your criteria. However, I too am unconvinced by Fraser as Chairman. Would prefer to have someone a bit older in charge, am personally thinking along the lines of Graham Gooch or someone similar. However, my concern with having Gooch or Watkinson or Fraser on the selection panel would be bias towards home county players, i.e. Essex, Lancashire or Middlesex respectively.

 

[Richard]

Gooch as a selector between 1996 and 1999 wasn't exactly a rip-roaring success. I absolutely loved the guy as a batsman and don't think he's diabolical as a judge of cricketer but the gripe I've always had with him (it was his big failing as captain) is he's too keen on players who come accross as real hard-workers and can easily alienate those who he perceives (sometimes, inevitably, wrongly) to be slackers.

He too falls down on the failure to differentiate between FC and OD cricket, but as I say - so does practically every radio\TV commentator and newspaper journalist I've ever come accross.

 

[ozone]

I have to say, I had reservations about saying Gooch, but can't really think of anyone else in the same kind of mould. For me, someone from that generation would be ideal though because they're still in touch with the game without being closely attached (in the buddy sense).

 

[Goughy]

Not sure how you would stop the selectors from being friends with current test players.

It isnt healthy to have a selector that has been traveling the world and playing with guys for a long time and then expect him to be objective when assessing players that he has such a close personal working relationship with that is so recent and with so many as peers and friends.

 

[Goughy]

Interesting post.
I agree with your criteria.
The only thing on which I disagree is that personally I wouldn't want Watkinson anywhere near the England team, and I'm unconvinced by Fraser despite having had the pleasure (?) of listening to his views for some time on TMS now.

What about the inclusion of someone like Crawley? Multi talented cricketer, very experienced, well educated, played for different Counties and knows the domestic scene inside out.

 

[Richard]

I have to say, I had reservations about saying Gooch, but can't really think of anyone else in the same kind of mould. For me, someone from that generation would be ideal though because they're still in touch with the game without being closely attached (in the buddy sense).

Certainly, all current selectors (2000s, 2010s) should be born sometime from the mid-1950s to the late-1960s, yes, I'd agree with that.

 

[zaremba]

What about the inclusion of someone like Crawley? Multi talented cricketer, very experienced, well educated, played for different Counties and knows the domestic scene inside out.

Yep maybe. To be honest though I don't know how well qualified each of the potential candidates would be, including Crawley.

On the subject of JC, a real contender for the "should have made it in Test cricket but didn't" thread.

 

[Goughy]

I prefer the younger names but for an older group how about-

Mike Brearley
Jack Hampshire
Clive Radley

Not quite sure of their current roles but a lot of knowledge and experience would be brought to the table.

 

[zaremba]

I prefer the younger names but for an older group how about-

Mike Brearley
Jack Hampshire
Clive Radley

Not quite sure of their current roles but a lot of knowledge and experience would be brought to the table.

Would love to see Brearley involved.

 

[Richard]

Brearley's an interesting one. Always wondered why he's never been involved in the England set-up post-captaincy (and have never actually known for certain that he hasn't been FTR). You'd imagine someone of his leadership and tactical skill would be invaluable.

Can only guess it's a question of desire on his own part, but you'd think that the right offer would've had to have at least come close to tempting him. It's certainly not the case that he's lost interest in the game as he was MCC president not so long ago.

 

[ozone]

Yea, having Brearley in the setup would be fantastic.

 

[Goughy]

Would love to see Brearley involved.

TBH, of the 3 I mentioned he is the one Id like to see involved least. I thought Id include him as he is high profile. He isnt really my cup of tea.

I just dont think he has shown much in terms of talent evaluation and has not been involved with the game recently.

Im sure hands on captaincy is very different to hands off selection.

However, I can see why some would like to see him included.