The Secret of Glenn McGrath's Success

[Slifer]

I am always amazed at people who say McGrath was not a fast bowler. He was not the fastest like Steyn but he was quite fast. People wouldn't find it difficult to handle him just because he pitched it at a particular spot the way they did. He was a fast medium bowler who had great accuracy and a bit of variation to fox the batsmen. The best fast bowler from the 90s bar none.

Umm no. Post 2000 until the emergence of Steyn yes, but in the 90s there was nothing to choose between the following : Mcgrath, Ambrose, Wasim, Donald, Pollock (90s version). Waqar and Walsh weren't that far behind either.

 

[Blocky]

Height + Ability to adjust length to the perfect spot for each pitch + hitting the seam every delivery.

 

[Victor Ian]

perhaps the speed of the ball increases threat but not by as much as the angle of it. McGrath's angles more than made up for the speed. I seem to remember batsman being more 'rushed' by him than Lee because with him they needed more time to adjust to the right technique to not get out whereas with Lee you just needed the time to hang the bat out.

 

[Blocky]

Pace is a tool and can be an effective one, but nothing beats hitting the right length for the wicket repeatedly.

It's why Shaun Pollock was effective against all comers his entire career barely scraping over 130KMH and why Brett Lee was awfully ineffective against anyone who just didn't have the mental game to face pace.

You rarely get a bowler who can put pace + movement + length together and that's a Malcolm Marshall / Dennis Lillee / Richard Hadlee / Dale Steyn scenario and most of the time they're simply too good to get the edge.

 

[Dan]

Curious, does that mean you rate the four mentioned above McGrath because they have the extra traits? Or is McGrath still equal to, or above, on the basis that he was so bloody far ahead in terms of hitting the seam on a length and getting batsmen out?

 

[Blocky]

Curious, does that mean you rate the four mentioned above McGrath because they have the extra traits? Or is McGrath still equal to, or above, on the basis that he was so bloody far ahead in terms of hitting the seam on a length and getting batsmen out?

They're all much of a muchness in my view in their ability to work batsmen out. I give Steyn and Hadlee more credit because for large chunks of their career, they were carrying ineffective bowling attacks on their shoulders.

McGrath always had Warne, and had big chunks of time with Gillespie bowling like a demon too.
Marshall had the greatest pace bowling line up ever.
Pollock operated with Allan Donald, Ntini, Kallis, etc.
Lillee had some pretty damn handy players around him too.

Steyn has had bits and pieces of time with other great cricketers, but at times has been the only great bowler for South Africa.
Hadlee was pretty much the only great cricketer for NZ for most of his career, until arguably the emergence of Crowe.

What I liked about McGrath is he could do it in almost any condition, he wasn't the previous day version of Anderson/Boult/Southee/Starc/Johnson who requires swinging conditions to be consistently threatening. He could do it pretty much across the board.

If you're asking me who the best of all of them is, I'd have to go for Steyn, solely because he's bowled his entire career at a time that bat has increasingly dominated the ball due to highway roads for pitches. Where as the previous generation had the Ponting/Dravid/Kallis players - this generation has had every single team in test cricket outside the minnows with players averaging 50 or more.

 

[ImpatientLime]

Umm no. Post 2000 until the emergence of Steyn yes, but in the 90s there was nothing to choose between the following : Mcgrath, Ambrose, Wasim, Donald, Pollock (90s version). Waqar and Walsh weren't that far behind either.

always thought mcgrath and curtly were on another level to the rest of those guys.

 

[marc71178]

Have to say the idea that Steyn has spent the majority of his career carrying a largely ineffective attack to be a new one to me and dare I say it, a complete load of revisionist bollocks.

 

[honestbharani]

I will have it as Steyn, Ambrose, McGrath amongst the bowlers I have seen. I know it is a big call, but damnit Steyn is just that damn ****ing good.


EDIT: I guess I should mention that list is in order of how I would rank them.

 

[RossTaylorsBox]

How is that a big call?

 

[harsh.ag]

Marshall, McGrath, Hadlee, and Steyn are the best of the best. Dominated everywhere. Huge champs.

 

[weldone]

Marshall, McGrath, Hadlee, and Steyn are the best of the best. Dominated everywhere. Huge champs.

add Ambrose

 

[honestbharani]

How is that a big call?

coz of the competition.

 

[Stapel]

It's never easy to compare.....

It sure as hell helps when your batting team mates put up 500+ before you start bowling. Or, when having a rare off-day, the likes of Warne, Gillespie, Kasper, or Lee do the damage. Yet, it seems odd to hold that against a bowler, when judging him.

 

[listento_me]

I am always amazed at people who say McGrath was not a fast bowler. He was not the fastest like Steyn but he was quite fast. People wouldn't find it difficult to handle him just because he pitched it at a particular spot the way they did. He was a fast medium bowler who had great accuracy and a bit of variation to fox the batsmen. The best fast bowler from the 90s bar none.

I watched his career from around 1999 to the day he retired. For almost the majority of this time, when he was on my TV screens repeatedly in ODI tournaments and the Ashes, I hardly saw him touch 85mph and by the time 2002/03 rolled round he was hitting 80mph consistently but hardly ever exceeding it, especially in test spells.

A fast bowler in the truest sense should be between 85-90 for the majority of his bowling and 90+ for those who are extremely fast. I was spoiled throughout the 90s and the early part of the last decade with Wasim, Waqar, Donald, the Windians, Akhtar and of course Lee. So it's very difficult for me to label McGrath fast when he was the slowest of that great pack. Although skill wise he was above all of them except Wasim.

 

[akilana]

Have to say the idea that Steyn has spent the majority of his career carrying a largely ineffective attack to be a new one to me and dare I say it, a complete load of revisionist bollocks.

Nah. That was fairly accurate. Who did they have beside Steyn?

 

[Bijed]

A fast bowler in the truest sense should be between 85-90 for the majority of his bowling and 90+ for those who are extremely fast.

That's a very agreeable definition and McGrath didn't fall into that bracket, though tbf I think the post you originally responded was describing him as fast in the commonly used sense of 'not a spinner or a genuine medium pacer'.

Although skill wise he was above all of them except Wasim

Yeah, the actual skill of a bowler seems to be overlooked so often (not so much by CW course) when it is of course somewhat important - see Saj Mahmood.

Similar kind of thing with spinners, a guy at work was basically saying that Moeen was struggling (against Sri Lanka, I think) because he was some kind of right-arm Ashley Giles, when the problem was moreso that he was bowling a lot of balls for which the term 'pie' would be somewhat flattering.

I mean, even Herath doesn't generally spin the ball miles and he's indisputably the best bowler in the world right now

 

[listento_me]

That's a very agreeable definition and McGrath didn't fall into that bracket, though tbf I think the post you originally responded was describing him as fast in the commonly used sense of 'not a spinner or a genuine medium pacer'.



Yeah, the actual skill of a bowler seems to be overlooked so often (not so much by CW course) when it is of course somewhat important - see Saj Mahmood.

Similar kind of thing with spinners, a guy at work was basically saying that Moeen was struggling (against Sri Lanka, I think) because he was some kind of right-arm Ashley Giles, when the problem was moreso that he was bowling a lot of balls for which the term 'pie' would be somewhat flattering.

I mean, even Herath doesn't generally spin the ball miles and he's indisputably the best bowler in the world right now

Shah and Ashwin are both superior but I get what you mean.

Btw, a bit unfair on Moeen? lol I mean he is no Swann or Ajmal but the guy has done ok in most series and was second only to Stokes in terms of bowling against Bang. I just feel he is an elegant middle order batsman being forced to perform the role of front line spinner. If only Cook knew how to set feels for a leggy, Rashid could do the job.

 

[Bijed]

Shah and Ashwin are both superior but I get what you mean.

Btw, a bit unfair on Moeen? lol I mean he is no Swann or Ajmal but the guy has done ok in most series and was second only to Stokes in terms of bowling against Bang. I just feel he is an elegant middle order batsman being forced to perform the role of front line spinner. If only Cook knew how to set feels for a leggy, Rashid could do the job.

Yeah, I didn't mean to put Moeen down quite so much there - I agree with your assessment of him, it's just that at the point when I had that particular conversation he was going through a phase of not bowling well at all. I'm generally a fan of his.

 

[Blocky]

Have to say the idea that Steyn has spent the majority of his career carrying a largely ineffective attack to be a new one to me and dare I say it, a complete load of revisionist bollocks.

Outside Philander - who do you think he's had in most of his tests?

Aging, weary Pollock, Kallis and Ntini
Inconsistent Morkel.