TheBrand
First Class Debutant
Nicholls and Conway have both kept previously, Conway currently keeping in T20 for Wellington.
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*Unofficial* New Zealand Black Caps Thread
- Thread starter NZTailender
- Start date
Howsie
International Captain
Surely Seifert gets a run at the top of the order...
imo we have to give the likes of Seifert, Phillips, Young, Conway and maybe even Rachin a proper run in the one day team over the next 12-18 months. It’s all well and good for Guptill and Taylor to say they want to play until the next World Cup but that’s still over two years away. We don’t want another Munro situation and carrying guys into a World Cup with no back up ready to go
imo we have to give the likes of Seifert, Phillips, Young, Conway and maybe even Rachin a proper run in the one day team over the next 12-18 months. It’s all well and good for Guptill and Taylor to say they want to play until the next World Cup but that’s still over two years away. We don’t want another Munro situation and carrying guys into a World Cup with no back up ready to go
TheBrand
First Class Debutant
Seifert's list A numbers aren't great, average mid 20's from memory. Hard to ignore Conway I think.
Howsie
International Captain
Yeah but how many List A games has Seifert played in the last 2-3 years?
thundaboult
International Debutant
So is george worker just not rated as someone who can bat well against top class bowling attacks? Seems like he did everything possible at domestic LIST A level but just never got his due. And now he isn't exactly young either so he might be an uninspiring selection.
I agree with some of the posters above about younger guys getting their chances. And I really feel like Latham, Nicholls, KW and Ross offer exactly the same thing. That's too much cake and not enough firepower. All of them basically the same nitty gritty bat a strike rate of 70-85 accumulators. Having said that, Nicholls, Latham and Ross did bat with good and sometimes awesome strike rates against India last year. I still believe in Guptill as he is the only one who actually goes after ANY bowling attack and does it well. But the next cup being in India and his record there....being an oldie too...idk, its not looking good. I think its time for Rachin, Conway, Young, Phillips and maybe even Seifert to be given the affirmative. Just not convinced with Latham and Nicholls being long term ODI contenders.
I also noticed that Seifert has put a leash on the slogging, hoiks, flashy scoops and is looking to bat right through a t20 innings. He got great results with it against Pak and in the recent super smash games. The runs are flowing. That kind of batting mindset will help him in LIST A as well. I just hope he doesn't get too carried away with the batting long thing....most of his bigger innings against Pak and for ND were at a SR between 88 and 133. Guess I'm just nitpicking but maybe a bit more strike rotation can help. Goddamn he just looks so capable of consistently striking at 145+ when he stops slogging/scooping aimlessly and bats with composure + intent.
I agree with some of the posters above about younger guys getting their chances. And I really feel like Latham, Nicholls, KW and Ross offer exactly the same thing. That's too much cake and not enough firepower. All of them basically the same nitty gritty bat a strike rate of 70-85 accumulators. Having said that, Nicholls, Latham and Ross did bat with good and sometimes awesome strike rates against India last year. I still believe in Guptill as he is the only one who actually goes after ANY bowling attack and does it well. But the next cup being in India and his record there....being an oldie too...idk, its not looking good. I think its time for Rachin, Conway, Young, Phillips and maybe even Seifert to be given the affirmative. Just not convinced with Latham and Nicholls being long term ODI contenders.
I also noticed that Seifert has put a leash on the slogging, hoiks, flashy scoops and is looking to bat right through a t20 innings. He got great results with it against Pak and in the recent super smash games. The runs are flowing. That kind of batting mindset will help him in LIST A as well. I just hope he doesn't get too carried away with the batting long thing....most of his bigger innings against Pak and for ND were at a SR between 88 and 133. Guess I'm just nitpicking but maybe a bit more strike rotation can help. Goddamn he just looks so capable of consistently striking at 145+ when he stops slogging/scooping aimlessly and bats with composure + intent.
The Hutt Rec
International Vice-Captain
I think the side needs a total overhaul tbh. Looking at the side for our last ODI, the first match of the ill-fated series in Aus:
Guptill
Nicholls
Williamson
Taylor
Latham
Neesham
CDG
Santner
Sodhi
Ferguson
Boult
Soundly beaten in that match. Of the top order I would think only Williamson and Taylor should be certainties ... Conway a must and Seifert definitely worth a go as keeper/batsman. Pretty happy with Neesham and CDG as the all-rounders for now. Boult and Ferguson obvious picks when fit, Jamieson will come in for sure ... Henry I'm not fussed about, I think 2019 might have been the end of his run. Santner still the best spinning option I guess, but keeping an eye on Rachin.
So my next gen ODI side:
Seifert
Conway
Williamson
Taylor
Nicholls/Chapman
Neesham
CDG
Santner/Rachin
Jamieson
Ferguson
Boult
Guptill
Nicholls
Williamson
Taylor
Latham
Neesham
CDG
Santner
Sodhi
Ferguson
Boult
Soundly beaten in that match. Of the top order I would think only Williamson and Taylor should be certainties ... Conway a must and Seifert definitely worth a go as keeper/batsman. Pretty happy with Neesham and CDG as the all-rounders for now. Boult and Ferguson obvious picks when fit, Jamieson will come in for sure ... Henry I'm not fussed about, I think 2019 might have been the end of his run. Santner still the best spinning option I guess, but keeping an eye on Rachin.
So my next gen ODI side:
Seifert
Conway
Williamson
Taylor
Nicholls/Chapman
Neesham
CDG
Santner/Rachin
Jamieson
Ferguson
Boult
Kippax
Cricketer Of The Year
Well Henry Shipley has been joined by Jayden Lennox as the latest anon to be seen penetrating that Seifert blockhole, only four days ago.
The target demo of course will still love Seifert for being a big ol' T20 star and occasionally giving even the most random and inadequate proposition a chance at glory. One only needs to hark back though to how that still very sizable and influential contingent of Facebook middle-aged types in NZ turned very bitterly and nastily on Munro in 2019.
The target demo of course will still love Seifert for being a big ol' T20 star and occasionally giving even the most random and inadequate proposition a chance at glory. One only needs to hark back though to how that still very sizable and influential contingent of Facebook middle-aged types in NZ turned very bitterly and nastily on Munro in 2019.
Yeah, having seen the way he played in the Pakistan T20s he needs to be considered. His List A record is somewhat irrelevant as it's years ago and before he seemingly found a more mature, consistent approach this year.
Nicholls shouldn't be our ODI opener but will be, based on their pick and stick mentality. I'm not even sure he's in our best XI going forward.
To me, Phillips/Seifert/Conway are part of our best side going forward. And don't forget, last time Young played in NZ coloured clothes he scored back to back tons. Ross I still think has a part to play in that format and Kane is obviously King.
It's a nice problem - how do we find a way to promote and build international ODI ability into Phillips, Seifert, Conway, Young because they're the future of our top order. And which of them is going to play spin well enough to be a part of India 2023?
Fuller Pilch
Hall of Fame Member
Also depends on India-England and South Africa-Australia.
Binkley
U19 Captain
I think SA beating Australia at home is much more likely than England beating India. Can you imagine what the wickets will be like if India needs a 3-0 or 4-0 score line? So I guess I want India to be in the driving seat at the end of the current series, to make an India vs NZ final the most likely outcome?
They should both be on watch. But yeah, Gup's spot isn't nailed in either. Terrible World Cup, and really nothing to speak of (bar Sri Lanka and Bangladesh) a year and a half previous to that. Did score runs v India last summer, but he seems in terrible nick and needs some more quickly (when given the chance).
Only issue for me is his strike rate. Has never struck at 100+ opening and is striking at an average of 70 per 100 balls. The knock in the WC final was required/tough pitch, but I don't know if he has it in him for striking at over a run a ball. Which is fine if the guy at the other end is doing so...
The Hutt Rec
International Vice-Captain
Nicholls does average 55 at 5 (strikerate 112) and 36 opening (strikerate 70). Not a big sample size for either, but I definitely see him as a 5 in ODIs.
straw man
Hall of Fame Member
If the next ODI world cup is in India that makes it much more likely that Latham retains a spot in the middle order - he was gun last time in India.
Other than that it's hard to get too excited about ODIs at the moment; it's a rebuilding/reconfiguring of the side but without any road tests in the near future.
Other than that it's hard to get too excited about ODIs at the moment; it's a rebuilding/reconfiguring of the side but without any road tests in the near future.
