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Trent Bridge & Oval

Naveed

Cricket Spectator
What have the pitches been like this year. I know the Oval is pretty flat......but how has TB been this season?

I know when SA played there a couple of years ago it was a nightmare pitch from day 3......extremly variable bounce......James Kirtly got 6 for.
 

archie mac

International Coach
Naveed said:
What have the pitches been like this year. I know the Oval is pretty flat......but how has TB been this season?

I know when SA played there a couple of years ago it was a nightmare pitch from day 3......extremly variable bounce......James Kirtly got 6 for.
I heard Deano on the radio say that he thought TB would be the best batting wicket in the series.
 

FaaipDeOiad

Hall of Fame Member
archie mac said:
I heard Deano on the radio say that he thought TB would be the best batting wicket in the series.
Deano actually said it was traditionally the best batting wicket in England and "everyone knows it". That, as far as I'm concerned, is crap, since The Oval has a much bigger reputation for being flat.

I'd take his comments with a pinch of salt.
 

Pedro Delgado

International Debutant
JASON said:
I expect the Aussies to come back with a vengeance and take the next 2 tests 2-0 !! :D
That wouldn't be a surprise, a fit McGrath/Clarke bodes well for 'em. That said, the series is so unpredictable that I am giving up calling it now.
 

Naveed

Cricket Spectator
The way Flintoff and Jones are reversing it no pith can be called flat....the same with Warne you cant call any pitch flat as long as he is bowling.

Reverse swing will win England the series. It is pretty hard to coach a team to bat against reverse swing in the middle of the series. I will be surprised if the pitches are anything other than dry and hard to get reverse swing.

The Aussies are talking of getting a plan against RS....but RS is not something like conventional swing which fades away after 10 overs.......it was reversing it from 20th to the 80th over at OT. So it would mean a completly new gameplan not just a minor adjustment....you just can't do it in the middle of a series.......it is like asking right handers to bat lefthanded.
 

wpdavid

Hall of Fame Member
Naveed said:
What have the pitches been like this year. I know the Oval is pretty flat......but how has TB been this season?

I know when SA played there a couple of years ago it was a nightmare pitch from day 3......extremly variable bounce......James Kirtly got 6 for.
OTOH Trent Bridge was pretty reasonable for the batters when NZ toured last year.

As for the Oval, all I will add is that Harmison's best home performances in 2003 & 2004 were at the Oval. Here's hoping ....
 

Barney Rubble

International Coach
wpdavid said:
OTOH Trent Bridge was pretty reasonable for the batters when NZ toured last year.

As for the Oval, all I will add is that Harmison's best home performances in 2003 & 2004 were at the Oval. Here's hoping ....
Mark Nicholas was saying in his Telegraph column on Wednesday that some of the England players are yet to hit form, and mentioned how worried the Aussies might be that they will - he ended the passage with "Imagine if Steve Harmison were to hit his straps at Trent Bridge. The Aussies might trade more reverse swing for that."

There's no denying Harmison hasn't been on top form so far - if he does get there at some point over the next two Tests, and by that I mean extreme bounce, searing pace, and 5/6/7-wicket hauls, the Aussies will be really in trouble.
 

tooextracool

International Coach
Barney Rubble said:
There's no denying Harmison hasn't been on top form so far - if he does get there at some point over the next two Tests, and by that I mean extreme bounce, searing pace, and 5/6/7-wicket hauls, the Aussies will be really in trouble.
its not form really. its hard to deny that harmison has bowled any differently in these last 2 test matches than he did in that 1st test at Lords. the difference being that at Lords he had the conditions to his favor, while in the next 2 he didnt. if harmison were to get uneven bounce/ seam movement in any of the next 2 tests, i have no doubt that he'll be quite a force for australia to play against.
 

tooextracool

International Coach
Naveed said:
What have the pitches been like this year. I know the Oval is pretty flat......but how has TB been this season?

I know when SA played there a couple of years ago it was a nightmare pitch from day 3......extremly variable bounce......James Kirtly got 6 for.

nobody knows what to expect from TB to be honest. the pitch last year started flat and then took turn towards the end as ashley giles took 4/46. the pitch before that was an absolute disaster of a wicket that offered plenty of uneven bounce on which even a bowler as rubbish as james kirtley took 6/34. the one in 2002 was a flat batting wicket that offered nothing for the bowlers. and the one in the ashes series in 2001 was a seamers paradise.
 

Barney Rubble

International Coach
tooextracool said:
its not form really. its hard to deny that harmison has bowled any differently in these last 2 test matches than he did in that 1st test at Lords. the difference being that at Lords he had the conditions to his favor, while in the next 2 he didnt. if harmison were to get uneven bounce/ seam movement in any of the next 2 tests, i have no doubt that he'll be quite a force for australia to play against.
Yeah that's true actually. I'm being a little harsh in saying he was out of form. A quick, bouncy pitch at Trent Bridge should make for a great Test match - especially if Tait plays (which IMHO is fairly likely).
 

wpdavid

Hall of Fame Member
Barney Rubble said:
Yeah that's true actually. I'm being a little harsh in saying he (Harmison) was out of form. A quick, bouncy pitch at Trent Bridge should make for a great Test match - especially if Tait plays (which IMHO is fairly likely).
And yet, Lee has had some highly effective spells in the last 2 tests. I know he's not identical to Harmison, but it shows what an out & out quick could do if he put the ball in the right areas.

I think Nicholas is probably right about Harmison. If he can find his radar, England will have something they've missed at Edgbaston & OT. The other positive I'd suggest is that Hoggard bowled some decent stuff in the 2nd innings at OT, so maybe he's belatedly finding some form.
 

Barney Rubble

International Coach
wpdavid said:
And yet, Lee has had some highly effective spells in the last 2 tests. I know he's not identical to Harmison, but it shows what an out & out quick could do if he put the ball in the right areas.

I think Nicholas is probably right about Harmison. If he can find his radar, England will have something they've missed at Edgbaston & OT. The other positive I'd suggest is that Hoggard bowled some decent stuff in the 2nd innings at OT, so maybe he's belatedly finding some form.
Agree re: Hoggard - he was probably worse than I've ever seen him for the first five innings of this series, bowled some absolute tripe and couldn't swing it at all.

The next Test could be very interesting indeed - we could have FIVE bowlers capable of reaching 90mph plus playing in the same game! Last time that must have happened was probably WI v Aus in the 80s sometime......
 

aussie

Hall of Fame Member
well looking at what kind of pitches they had last season, the Oval pitch had plenty of bounce for the WI test match & the TB pitch vs NZ had something their for both bowlers & batsmen could have played their shots without much fuss.
 

Rich2001

International Captain
Not sure how reliable it is but i've heard that Trent Bridge will be a pretty good bowling wicket with a fair amount of swing.

Looking at some of the totals this season it looks like Trent Bridge has flatten out a fair bit though with some bigish scores, well it can't be any worse than last summer when Kent beat Notts inside two days :huh:
 

marc71178

Eyes not spreadsheets
Barney Rubble said:
The next Test could be very interesting indeed - we could have FIVE bowlers capable of reaching 90mph plus playing in the same game! Last time that must have happened was probably WI v Aus in the 80s sometime......
Erm, Giles doesn't bowl at 90+?
 

Majin

International Debutant
Barney Rubble said:
Agree re: Hoggard - he was probably worse than I've ever seen him for the first five innings of this series, bowled some absolute tripe and couldn't swing it at all.

The next Test could be very interesting indeed - we could have FIVE bowlers capable of reaching 90mph plus playing in the same game! Last time that must have happened was probably WI v Aus in the 80s sometime......
What about England in Windies? Harmison, Flintoff, Jones, Edwards and Best?
 

tooextracool

International Coach
wpdavid said:
And yet, Lee has had some highly effective spells in the last 2 tests. I know he's not identical to Harmison, but it shows what an out & out quick could do if he put the ball in the right areas.
lee hasnt exactly caused that many problems to the england batters either. harmison too has had a couple of good spells this series-after lunch on the last day with simon jones, but i dont think that the pitch has suited either of them. i do think though that lee has got a bit more out of the wicket than harmison given that hes a bit faster and can reverse it while not a great deal.
 

Magrat Garlick

Global Moderator
Naveed said:
The way Flintoff and Jones are reversing it no pith can be called flat....the same with Warne you cant call any pitch flat as long as he is bowling.

Reverse swing will win England the series. It is pretty hard to coach a team to bat against reverse swing in the middle of the series. I will be surprised if the pitches are anything other than dry and hard to get reverse swing.

The Aussies are talking of getting a plan against RS....but RS is not something like conventional swing which fades away after 10 overs.......it was reversing it from 20th to the 80th over at OT. So it would mean a completly new gameplan not just a minor adjustment....you just can't do it in the middle of a series.......it is like asking right handers to bat lefthanded.
Welcome to CW :)

You make a fair point about reverse swing, but there's also the fact that Vaughan's devoid of confidence, Bell still struggles to buy a run, plus Warne is bound to get Flintoff out early one of these days.

There's arguments for and against both sides - each has weaknesses and strengths. Personally, I won't say England or Australia "should win" this till the last clatter of stumps at The Oval in two weeks. Until then, I'll enjoy the cricket.

(PS - any hints on where I can watch the Ashes in Norway, seeing as you also claim to be in this fair but cold country?)
 

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