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Thread: Who is really to blame for England's batting collapses post 2011 in test series?

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    Cricketer Of The Year Cabinet96's Avatar
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    Who is really to blame for England's batting collapses post 2011 in test series?

    Discuss.
    Quote Originally Posted by Flem274* View Post
    This English top three are cornflakes. They're not the most exciting thing out but they're pretty effective. Then the middle order are the sugar. Would be too much on their own but added to the cornflakes they add some much needed interest

    When KP returns he will be the banana..

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    Request Your Custom Title Now! Spikey's Avatar
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    Cook has made 6 fifties and counting without going onto a century iirc
    Indians can't bowl - Where has the rumour come from as I myself and many indian friends arwe competent fast bowlers ?

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    Englishman BoyBrumby's Avatar
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    Messrs Johnson and Harris, pretty much.
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    Cricketer Of The Year Cabinet96's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Spikey View Post
    Cook has made 6 fifties and counting without going onto a century iirc
    Not much better from our four number threes: Batting records | Test matches | Cricinfo Statsguru | ESPN Cricinfo

    Yes I'm blaming you Jimmy.


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    Cricketer Of The Year Cabinet96's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by BoyBrumby View Post
    Messrs Johnson and Harris, pretty much.
    Doesn't explain the collapses against Pakistan. And Sri Lanka. And the West Indies. And South Africa. And India. And New Zealand.

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    Cricket Web: All-Time Legend Furball's Avatar
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    Doing their best to maintain tradition IIRC

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    Cricket Web: All-Time Legend Furball's Avatar
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    The answer is clearly Shane Watson, ftr.

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    Englishman BoyBrumby's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cabinet96 View Post
    Doesn't explain the collapses against Pakistan. And Sri Lanka. And the West Indies. And South Africa. And India. And New Zealand.
    Could we just pretend I actually read the thread title before I posted my semi-smart arse one liner and say that I was using "Messrs Johnson and Harris" as a synecdoche for all the quality bowlers they've faced in those series?

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    Hall of Fame Member steds's Avatar
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    Jonathan Trott.

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    Graham Gooch??

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    International Captain hendrix's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by BoyBrumby View Post
    Could we just pretend I actually read the thread title before I posted my semi-smart arse one liner and say that I was using "Messrs Johnson and Harris" as a synecdoche for all the quality bowlers they've faced in those series?
    This is a very un-third-gear comment, tbh.

    Still though, good batsmen should be able to score runs against good bowling.

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    State Regular L Trumper's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cabinet96 View Post
    Doesn't explain the collapses against Pakistan. And Sri Lanka. And the West Indies. And South Africa. And India. And New Zealand.
    It mostly stems from the fact where 1) each batter is kinda assigned a specific role to perform. 2) And trying to find the players who will play in a way that will fit the system that is currently existing. 3) Obviously world class attacks make it difficult.

    In regards to 1st point, even when Eng are winning under flower there was this stupid idea about first 3 defending, and next 4 attacking etc. Once the so called defenders started to fail, middle order started playing a "no where game" of defend or attack. Losing Collingwood really ****ed them, especially when collapses happen. During 06 - 08 KP-Colly used to do a lot of rescue acts. Now no one in the middle order really got any clue on how to play.
    2nd point is the worst aspect of Flower's reign. Of all the players that picked under Flower only Trott was there for any length. For whatever reason they started treating international team as football club, which is extravagantly stupid. Instead of selecting best batsmen and build team, they decided to have a blue print of batting and try to search who fit in those rules,and the problem is the best batsmen available are not necessarily the one that fits the so called system.

    Long story short, the main reason for collapse is middle and lower middle order simply forget how to rotate strike. I miss Colly.

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    Virat Kohli (c) Jono's Avatar
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    Probably the batsmen.
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    Hall of Fame Member Marcuss's Avatar
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    Pretty sure it's me. I put money on us to beat Pakistan which inevitably jinxed us - or so my betting history would have be believe.
    The bowlers did their best to ensure a positive result and so the only way natural order could be restored (that being me never winning any money ever) was if the batting collapsed in a heap. The damage has been irreversible basically and just when there were shoots of recovery i.e. Ian Bell batting in the summer just gone - I went and wished for Mitchell Johnson to bowl well and look how that turned out.

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    Cricket Web: All-Time Legend Top_Cat's Avatar
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    Gotta be mental or team factors. I've seen absolutely nothing technically wrong with the English bats that haven't been there for many years.
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