Ashes Squad Announced

[marc71178]

They have both proved that that's not the case anymore, if Lewis was only good in one set of conditions, his FC record and ODI record wouldn't be close to what they are now.

Because he is always bowling to the top class batsmen of the calibre of Ponting, Langer, Hayden et al in County Cricket isn't he?!

 

[Mister Wright]

One has to question the logic of having 6 batsmen+ Flintoff while having 7 bowlers + Flintoff. With there already being question marks about Tresco, there would be no back up batsmen in the squad and we'd have to dig into the back up squad already.

That's because Vaughan will be a last minute addition.

 

[tooextracool]

That's because Vaughan will be a last minute addition.

yea add another injured player to the list who hasnt played a game in several months.
Plunkett shouldnt even be near the side IMO, forget about the fact that hes rubbish but in addition to the fact that hes also injured should surely have taken him out of the reckoning?

 

[Mister Wright]

yea add another injured player to the list who hasnt played a game in several months.
Plunkett shouldnt even be near the side IMO, forget about the fact that hes rubbish but in addition to the fact that hes also injured should surely have taken him out of the reckoning?

Don't worry. Vaughan was born to bat on Australian pitches. He could do a Bob Simpson and come out of retirment at the age of 60 and still average close to 80. It will be ok.

 

[tooextracool]

I wish people would stop steryotyping Hoggard and Lewis as bowlers that can only bowl when conditions suit them.

They have both proved that that's not the case anymore, if Lewis was only good in one set of conditions, his FC record and ODI record wouldn't be close to what they are now.

Lewis hasnt proven anything at the intl level. And bowlers like Bracken have already shown how you can be useless and one dimensional in test cricket while still ending up having an excellent FC record.

 

[tooextracool]

Clearly suggests Flintoff at 6, so who misses out?

When it comes down to these situations, it really comes down to who the selectors like better. As we all know thats collingwood, because hes a 'team man' and also the guy who claimed that England were going for the whitewash in Pakistan.
My thoughts on this havent changed. its simply pointless talking about whos going to miss out now because theres still 2 months to go and possibly a whole bunch of injuries to come. If there arent any injuries, then id pick the players that have best managed to adjust to the conditions and scored runs in the warm ups. And if that means excluding Pietersen then so be it.

 

[Burgey]

Without wanting to be overly intrusive if it's a private thing, does anyone actually know what's wrong with Trescothick?

If he is having some non-physical problems, this probably is not the place to tour.

Your side looks pretty solid, but the question marks remain over Cook, Bell, Read, Mahmood and even Strauss in Australian conditions. Still, they can do no more than perform as they have and everyone has to tour for the first time.

The only bowlers who have reasonable experience in Australian conditions are Harmison and Hoggard, both of whom have improved since last time. The others have very limited or no experience out here. IMO it will be important that they do not bowl too short, as young bowlers often do out here.

Can't wait for the Lee/ McGrath v Flintoff/ Pietersen battles on larger grounds. Big advantages for the bowlers here on faster wickets with bigger grounds and 2 men back for the hook/ pull. Warne v Bell/ Strauus/ Cook will also be great to watch. Will be good to see how those blokes approach him

Panesaar should do well- left arm spin is very handy in these parts.

Should be a great series. Can't wait.

 

[Pratters]

Tim de Lisle on Lewis before he wasn't selected:

Duncan Fletcher doubts whether Lewis is fast enough for Test cricket outisde England, which makes you wonder if he ever saw Terry Alderman or Damien Fleming in action. Lewis is in just that mould – nagging, swinging, testing, non-military medium, capable of outwitting the best players. If Jimmy Anderson is fit, I’d pick him and Lewis. If not, take Broad. But don’t be surprised if the selectors stick with Mahmood and Plunkett, the devils they know.

It is a bit simplsitic to discount Lewis just because he wasn't selected.

 

[vic_orthdox]

Underselling Fleming's pace a bit there, methinks...

 

[Pratters]

Ya fair point Jack but still he puts the point across well I think.

 

[Alysum]

what the hell is A Giles doing there?

 

[marc71178]

If there arent any injuries, then id pick the players that have best managed to adjust to the conditions and scored runs in the warm ups. And if that means excluding Pietersen then so be it.

Something I've often mentioned in the past 12 months - he continues to manage to be outperformed by the rest of the middle order yet retain the "number 1 pick" slot...

 

[GIMH]

Pietersen averages 46.83 post-Ashes
Bell averages 51.18 in the same period
Collingwood 48.47
Flintoff 30.37 and 28.04 with the ball

As I've said for quite sometime, I'd be quite happy with Flintoff at seven, with all three of KP, IB and PC playing. Flintoff, Hoggard, Harmison, Panesar is not an attack to be sniffed at, Collingwood, Bell and Pietersen can all turn their arm over if need be, though they do have only one Test wicket each.

It's not an issue of KP's performance not being good enough, it's the fact that the other two have performed better. KP averages 50+ against the Aussies though and still stands out as the most likely to succeed down under, especially against Warne and McGrath.

Throw in Cook (54.35) and if we bat down to Flintoff at 7, it's quite the middle order

 

[Steulen]

Pietersen, likeHarmison, must play, to leave them out would be insane.

They often fail spectacularly but on the occasions they do get it right they're a free ride to victory. Dependable batsmen like Bell and Collingwood will never have that quality.

Gimh's line-up would be mine too, in Monty England have a spin bowler who deserves to be one of the spearheads rather than just the controlling option a la Giles. He could decrease Flintoff's bowling burden, making a 4-man attack viable.

 

[adharcric]

The four-man attack will only work if ...
a) Flintoff doesn't become delusional and start overbowling himself like he's done in the past as captain
b) Harmison doesn't blow hot and cold in unpredictable fashion
c) Hoggard is consistent with good line-and-length
d) Panesar is given long spells to settle down

I would like to think it'll work, but I don't think so. If Cook, Pietersen, Bell and Collingwood are all averaging so high, they can afford one less batsman. Considering how fragile English bowlers are, they just might want that fifth option. Anderson or an in-form Mahmood for me.

Another issue is Trescothick. He's a real mystery and who knows if he'll even play in the Ashes. If he doesn't, Cook moves up and all the talk of six batsmen dies immediately.

 

[howardj]

Pietersen averages 46.83 post-Ashes
Bell averages 51.18 in the same period
Collingwood 48.47
Flintoff 30.37 and 28.04 with the ball

As I've said for quite sometime, I'd be quite happy with Flintoff at seven, with all three of KP, IB and PC playing. Flintoff, Hoggard, Harmison, Panesar is not an attack to be sniffed at, Collingwood, Bell and Pietersen can all turn their arm over if need be, though they do have only one Test wicket each.

It's not an issue of KP's performance not being good enough, it's the fact that the other two have performed better. KP averages 50+ against the Aussies though and still stands out as the most likely to succeed down under, especially against Warne and McGrath.

Throw in Cook (54.35) and if we bat down to Flintoff at 7, it's quite the middle order

Top post.

 

[Craig]

Yeah possibly, Bell had an awful Ashes and they probably still think of him as a bunny but Collingwood has always seemingly struggled on wickets with pace and bounce. Looks comfortable in subcontinental conditions but he looks very limited when faced with good pace bowlers on decent quick wickets.

So wouldn't then Sydney and to a lesser extent Adelaide (later on in the Test) be more suited. Although I agree Bell has to play otherwise, we would have another Hick or Ramprakash on your hands.

I think giving Flintoff the captaincy is too much to ask for him.

 

[Craig]

If Giles is fit, who would you rather play him or Panesar?

Panesar is probably better potentially, but I hold grave fears for his confidence if he makes blunders in the field, the Australian crowd will certaintly not forget it. Just wait to the Boxing Day Test.

 

[Barney Rubble]

Pietersen averages 46.83 post-Ashes
Bell averages 51.18 in the same period
Collingwood 48.47
Flintoff 30.37 and 28.04 with the ball

As I've said for quite sometime, I'd be quite happy with Flintoff at seven, with all three of KP, IB and PC playing. Flintoff, Hoggard, Harmison, Panesar is not an attack to be sniffed at, Collingwood, Bell and Pietersen can all turn their arm over if need be, though they do have only one Test wicket each.

It's not an issue of KP's performance not being good enough, it's the fact that the other two have performed better. KP averages 50+ against the Aussies though and still stands out as the most likely to succeed down under, especially against Warne and McGrath.

Throw in Cook (54.35) and if we bat down to Flintoff at 7, it's quite the middle order

I've been saying the same actually. The point that seals it for me is that I plain and simple don't trust Saj Mahmood or Liam Plunkett not to get belted around the park, and a tail of Hoggard-Harmison-Anderson-Panesar is out of the question.

 

[wpdavid]

Ya fair point Jack but still he puts the point across well I think.

He is ignoring the fact that Alderman's performances in England were exponentially better than in Australia. Still, TdL's never been worried about facts that don't suit a neat little soundbite.