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Thread: BBC's flops of the tournament 11...do you agree?

  1. #16
    International Coach pup11's Avatar
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    I think Vaughan deserved the no.1 spot there (because thats the only list he had a realistic chance of topping now) he worked pretty hard to suck that badly so give the guy some credit, i feel sorry for Michael all i can say is tough luck mate!!

  2. #17
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    Why would Vaughan be a "flop"? He has always been a poor ODI performer, so I don't understand why the expectation was high that he would score heaps of runs and lead England to victory.
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  3. #18
    U19 Vice-Captain Gloucefan's Avatar
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    Lara has been a flop in this tournament to be fair. Not in Joyce of Vaughan's league though.

  4. #19
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    Lara has averaged 41 with a strike rate of 80, not ground breaking stuff but it's hardly poor.


  5. #20
    U19 Vice-Captain Gloucefan's Avatar
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    He's scored 37, 44, 77, 37, 2, 21, 33.

    Better than I thought actually but I would still say for Lara that is a flop.

    Edit

    In that he wasn't there when the WI needed him. Never really went.

  6. #21
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    He finished the game off against Zimbabwe, was the only one (other than Ramdin) who stood up against Australia, had a similar effort against New Zealand and closed off the innings nicely against Bangladesh. Now you can argue that he wasn't a big influence in the tournament which would be fair, but he can't score runs for the other batsmen in the West Indies team. On the couple of occasions where the West Indies have been going well (Bangladesh and Zimbabwe) he was able to close the innings and when they were getting blasted away (Australia and New Zealand) then he showed some spine and fought back.

  7. #22
    U19 Vice-Captain Gloucefan's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Perm View Post
    He finished the game off against Zimbabwe, was the only one (other than Ramdin) who stood up against Australia, had a similar effort against New Zealand and closed off the innings nicely against Bangladesh. Now you can argue that he wasn't a big influence in the tournament which would be fair, but he can't score runs for the other batsmen in the West Indies team. On the couple of occasions where the West Indies have been going well (Bangladesh and Zimbabwe) he was able to close the innings and when they were getting blasted away (Australia and New Zealand) then he showed some spine and fought back.
    Fair enough, I was going on my general impression. He has been better then I thought.

  8. #23
    International Coach grecian's Avatar
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    Well people are mentioning Panesar, if you take out his performances against the minnows.

    Well on that criteria, Collingwood must be in with a shout for most disappointing player.

    83@16.60 and 3/166.

    Yet it's fairly silly to discount the minnow matches IMHO, mahmood, colly and Monty helped us avoid an humiliating exit, a la Pakistan and India, so shouldn't be forgotten.
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  9. #24
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    Quote Originally Posted by grecian View Post
    Well people are mentioning Panesar, if you take out his performances against the minnows.

    Well on that criteria, Collingwood must be in with a shout for most disappointing player.

    83@16.60 and 3/166.

    Yet it's fairly silly to discount the minnow matches IMHO, mahmood, colly and Monty helped us avoid an humiliating exit, a la Pakistan and India, so shouldn't be forgotten.
    Well if you take away the performances against minnows, then it ives you a better idea of how good they actually are.

  10. #25
    International Coach grecian's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Perm View Post
    Well if you take away the performances against minnows, then it ives you a better idea of how good they actually are.
    I'm just saying this thread is about "disappointing players in the tournament", the minnows constitute part of the tournament, imo.

  11. #26
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    Quote Originally Posted by grecian View Post
    I'm just saying this thread is about "disappointing players in the tournament", the minnows constitute part of the tournament, imo.
    That's true, but the "real" tournament is between the big teams, as cynical as it sounds. I'll use Panesar as an example, he has performed well against the minnows but has only taken 1 wicket against a Test playing nation, whom the real challenge is against. Now somebody like Michael Vaughan has been disappointing against both minnows and Test playing nations alike, meaning that his stats aren't cushioned by his acheivements against the minnows like Panesar's are.

    Not sure if that made sense at all but I'm sure you know what I mean.

  12. #27
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    Quote Originally Posted by Perm View Post
    That's true, but the "real" tournament is between the big teams, as cynical as it sounds. I'll use Panesar as an example, he has performed well against the minnows but has only taken 1 wicket against a Test playing nation, whom the real challenge is against. Now somebody like Michael Vaughan has been disappointing against both minnows and Test playing nations alike, meaning that his stats aren't cushioned by his acheivements against the minnows like Panesar's are.

    Not sure if that made sense at all but I'm sure you know what I mean.
    some people do well against the minnows some doesn't it's to their credit who can make the most out of the opportunity...it's not like it's only them who played against the minnows...

  13. #28
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    Quote Originally Posted by LA ICE-E View Post
    some people do well against the minnows some doesn't it's to their credit who can make the most out of the opportunity...it's not like it's only them who played against the minnows...
    No but some people get more opportunities to play against them and boost their stats, whether they be a batsman or bowler. Performing against the best ois what matters and by taking away games against minnows it gives a more accurate reading of how good a player is, IMO.

  14. #29
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    Its interesting the number of big name players that have flopped in the WC.
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  15. #30
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    Quote Originally Posted by age_master View Post
    Its interesting the number of big name players that have flopped in the WC.
    Like?

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