Who will win these battles

[subshakerz]

Smith average less then 36 vs bumrah with three tons.

Ok maybe I missed a series then. How many tests has he played against Bumrah?

 

[subshakerz]

Tbf, I think more often than not batsmen vs Bowlers hardly represent the way the matchup went properly. I mean, if you think about it, that's really the smarter thing to do. If a batsman scores some runs in a match against a bowler they, we will all praise the batsman irrespective of how many he scored to them. The same is not true for bowlers.

Yes. Smith scoring relatively less against Bumrah doesn't matter as much as surviving and the scoring against the rest which he did.

 

[govinda indian fan]

Ok maybe I missed a series then. How many tests has he played against Bumrah?

8 tests. In 2020/21 bgt he averaged 40 and in 2024/25 averaged 32

 

[Johan]

BGT final?

 

[govinda indian fan]

Yes. Smith scoring relatively less against Bumrah doesn't matter as much as surviving and the scoring against the rest which he did.

Thats what he did @ gabba and mcg. Played out bumrah and milked jadeja and fifth bowler. That what sachin used to do vs mcgarth. No shame in that. Would have loved to see 17 smith vs 24 bumrah

 

[govinda indian fan]

BGT final?

Wtc final. No bumrah was injured

 

[Johan]

Wtc final. No bumrah was injured

Oh, Wow.

 

[capt_Luffy]

Yes. Smith scoring relatively less against Bumrah doesn't matter as much as surviving and the scoring against the rest which he did.

Sometimes you just don't face him that long too though.

 

[govinda indian fan]

Oh, Wow.

He was injured from oct 22 to aug 23. 23 wtc final we missed two of our best players( pant and bumrah) otherwise match would have been lot closer

 

[OverratedSanity]

Yes. Smith scoring relatively less against Bumrah doesn't matter as much as surviving and the scoring against the rest which he did.

Yes but at the same time, does him only scoring off the others mean he actually played Bumrah well? It is a fundamental problem with these batsmen vs bowler stats. It has to be some combination of how many runs he scored vs that bowler+ how many he scored vs the attack + actual eye test to gauge how comfortable he was against him.

I dont think any of the above three in isolation provide any real insight into how well batsman A did vs bowler B. The second one, ie. "Runs vs attack containing the bowler" seems to have become the most popular stat to throw around when trying to make arguments of this type, and I'm not sure I agree it's particularly insightful as a stat.

 

[govinda indian fan]

@subshakerz how do you think imran vs root would play out. Imran inswingers play to root strength or will he bamboozle root

 

[govinda indian fan]

Yes but at the same time, does him only scoring off the others mean he actually played Bumrah well? It is a fundamental problem with these batsmen vs bowler stats. It has to be some combination of how many runs he scored vs that bowler+ how many he scored vs the attack + actual eye test to gauge how comfortable he was against him.

Root was more dominant vs boom in 21. But looked out of sorts in 24. Smith struggled but milked jadeja and reddy

 

[subshakerz]

8 tests. In 2020/21 bgt he averaged 40 and in 2024/25 averaged 32

I mean, Smith played him in three tests in 2021 and four tests in the last series. Last test not sure whether to count since he barely faced Bumrah who broke down.

 

[subshakerz]

Yes but at the same time, does him only scoring off the others mean he actually played Bumrah well? It is a fundamental problem with these batsmen vs bowler stats. It has to be some combination of how many runs he scored vs that bowler+ how many he scored vs the attack + actual eye test to gauge how comfortable he was against him.

I dont think any of the above three in isolation provide any real insight into how well batsman A did vs bowler B. The second one, ie. "Runs vs attack containing the bowler" seems to have become the most popular stat to throw around when trying to make arguments of this type, and I'm not sure I agree it's particularly insightful as a stat.

I think for an off peak Smith to average roughly 40 in games against Bumrah, despite clearly having issues against him, is pretty decent. I agree it doesn't tell the full picture though of how good a player was against a particularly bowler head to head aside from suggesting he survived him long enough to score.

 

[subshakerz]

@subshakerz how do you think imran vs root would play out. Imran inswingers play to root strength or will he bamboozle root

Not sure. Root does get across in the front foot so perhaps he would be the inswing LBW candidate. Edge Imran.

 

[Sliferxxxx]

The Bumrah pick is affected too by just how well Bumrah bowls in India and WI, which is where he's at his absolute best imo (Australia is a close third considering the conditions)

The WI batting Bumrah bowled to in WI was/is an absolute joke and minnow level. Bumrah in Australia is legit though.

 

[Thala_0710]

The WI batting Bumrah bowled to in WI was/is an absolute joke and minnow level. Bumrah in Australia is legit though.

Irrelevant of the batting, the way Bumrah bowled that series, not many batsmen would have been able to handle him tbh

 

[capt_Luffy]

The WI batting Bumrah bowled to in WI was/is an absolute joke and minnow level. Bumrah in Australia is legit though.

The batting was inept, but Bumrah legit bowled some of the absolute best I have seen him to.

 

[Sliferxxxx]

So your position is that Head fluked a great series against Bumrah, Smiths runs should be ignored because he didn't look comfy and Roots runs are all soft.

We all admire Bumrah but maybe try and keep your fanboyism in check.

He's trolling nothing more nothing less.

 

[subshakerz]

Irrelevant of the batting, the way Bumrah bowled that series, not many batsmen would have been able to handle him tbh

Yeah he was bending it crazily. Love that performance.