What to do about tour matches

[stephen]

Pattinson was better than all of them IMO.

I still foolishly hope we'll see him play another 30 tests.

 

[stephen]

Interestingly enough in Aus' first innings of this tour match the part time spinner Iftikhar Ahmed (51 career wickets in 56 matches) has bowled 23 overs out of 60. Possibly a bit of a disconnect between the evil plans of the PCB and the Pak A captain. Either way have to applaud Asad Shafiq (Pak A captain) by ignoring said evil plans and just doing what was best for the game.

Ok I just realised I got the two part time tweakers mixed up when reading your post.

Asad Shafiq, who has a grand total of 5 first class wickets has bowled as many overs as the seamers...

 

[Dan]

Wait so Pakistan haven't actually rolled out non-representative conditions after all, they've just played an under-strength side in the context of the ongoing Quaid-e-Azam competition?

 

[stephen]

They've rolled out a non-representative side. The conditions are probably close to what they would be for the tests.

People are complaining about the lack of spinners in the Pak A side more than anything. It's not as bad as Sri Lanka who have given unrepresentative conditions and teams to Australia (and I believe South Africa) but it's still bad.

 

[Starfighter]

Wait so Pakistan haven't actually rolled out non-representative conditions after all, they've just played an under-strength side in the context of the ongoing Quaid-e-Azam competition?

Ah no, I'm sure that even in Pakistan you could find decent spinner not currently playing in the FC competition rather than trotting out an unbalanced team, plus if that was the case the I doubt Waqas and Rahat would be playing.

 

[Dan]

Oh, so now it isn't about the conditions or the strength, the argument is against the team balance. Right.

 

[Borges]

Wait so Pakistan haven't actually rolled out non-representative conditions after all, they've just played an under-strength side in the context of the ongoing Quaid-e-Azam competition?

The side that they have played is a strong one, actually: the playing eleven has 900+ first class matches (including 100+ test matches) under their belt.
Astronomically stronger than the joke side that the Australians had presented when Pakistan toured.

 

[Dan]

Seriously, this genuinely amounts to "overseas boards are mean to us". Harden the **** up. Australia isn't losing because of some giant PCB-SLCB conspiracy to deny them proper preparation.

The PCB can't win here. If the deck isn't a dustbowl, they've trotted out unrepresentative conditions and they're evil. If they don't pick a leggie, they haven't provided representative opposition and they're evil. If they do pick a leggie and he's a third string 18yo, still not representative because Yasir is actually good, and they're evil. If they turn out a genuine A XI with fringe Test guys and they destroy Australia, the warm-up was too hard and Australia couldn't prepare properly and they're evil.

 

[Burgey]

Oh, so now it isn't about the conditions or the strength, the argument is against the team balance. Right.

I think it was always a out the team Pakistan picked wasn’t it? I can’t recall because I didn’t read the first couple of pages.

 

[trundler]

The match conditions have been absolutely representative too. Once again Australian fans are being unreasonable.

However, SL did do it to SA this year. 3 pacers on a green seamer followed by a spinathon in the tests.

 

[cnerd123]

Ifthikar Ahmed is a better spinner than any Australian not called Nathan Lyon anyways, so I don't see what the big deal is.

Typical #SoftAussies having a moan over nothing

 

[Dan]

I think it was always a out the team Pakistan picked wasn’t it? I can’t recall because I didn’t read the first couple of pages.

Might have been at the start but it definitely degenerated into a conditions discussion at some point (which is weird, because not like the PCB has any control over the ICC academy pitch conditions anyway), but then the thread turned into a nationalistic dickwaving shitfest and I don't think anyone can keep up with where the goalposts are any more.

tl;dr whatever PCB does bad whatever CA does good

 

[Starfighter]

Oh, so now it isn't about the conditions or the strength, the argument is against the team balance. Right.

Disingenuous. If you looked at the OP you'd see:

Pakistan just picked their 'A' Team for Australia's only match in UAE, and it does not include a single specialist spin bowler. A blatant tactic to rob the touring side of practice ahead of the Test series where they are expected to be facing a spin-heavy attack

A comment which though hyperbolic it may be nails the problem. You can't practice against spin by facing pace or vice versa.

Seriously, this genuinely amounts to "overseas boards are mean to us". Harden the **** up. Australia isn't losing because of some giant PCB-SLCB conspiracy to deny them proper preparation.

The PCB can't win here. If the deck isn't a dustbowl, they've trotted out unrepresentative conditions and they're evil. If they don't pick a leggie, they haven't provided representative opposition and they're evil. If they do pick a leggie and he's a third string 18yo, still not representative because Yasir is actually good, and they're evil. If they turn out a genuine A XI with fringe Test guys and they destroy Australia, the warm-up was too hard and Australia couldn't prepare properly and they're evil.

The PCB can win in fact by picking a team that features two (okayish) specialist spinners because that is the expected opposition in the test matches, rather than none. Even one would be better. The rest is straw-man.

 

[Dan]

Disingenuous. If you looked at the OP you'd see:

Yeah that OP has a second sentence too.

The PCB can win in fact by picking a team that features two (okayish) specialist spinners because that is the expected opposition in the test matches, rather than none. Even one would be better. The rest is straw-man.

Nah they still lose because then they've compromised their home advantage and gained nothing.

Again, why should Pakistan give up a core part of their advantage by helping the Australians counter their bowlers and tactics? It defies any sense that they'd do that!

Turn out an unrepresentative side, unrepresentative conditions or a bunch of 17yos and domestic rejects all you like. The onus is on the touring side, and the touring side alone, to be ready for the First Test.

 

[Starfighter]

Yeah that OP has a second sentence too.

Again, why should Pakistan give up a core part of their advantage by helping the Australians counter their bowlers and tactics? It defies any sense that they'd do that!

Turn out an unrepresentative side, unrepresentative conditions or a bunch of 17yos and domestic rejects all you like. The onus is on the touring side, and the touring side alone, to be ready for the First Test.

The touring side can only prepare against what is put in front of them. It's trivial and useless to blame them the way you are.

 

[morgieb]

I think it was always a out the team Pakistan picked wasn’t it? I can’t recall because I didn’t read the first couple of pages.

Assumption was given the team picked the expected conditions were going to be contrary to what the Test conditions were like.

Turns out that hasn't been the case, and it's basically comparable to having warm-ups only against understrength XI's.

 

[trundler]

Australia can make a team of clowns for a tour game owing to busy scheduling but Pakistan diabolically set their premier FC competition to begin now so they wouldn't have to choose specialist spinners.

 

[harsh.ag]

The touring side can only prepare against what is put in front of them. It's trivial and useless to blame them the way you are.

 

[Burgey]

God, imagine pouring R&D money into making a machine to replicate finger spin.

 

[Dan]

The touring side can only prepare against what is put in front of them. It's trivial and useless to blame them the way you are.

If the extent of your preparation starts a week out from the first Test, and is relying on the opposing board's altruism, then you damn well are to blame.

There's all sorts of ways to do it -- intra-squad matches in the country, hiring external bowlers to replicate key opposition players, organising A tours, developing different decks in your own country to give domestic players experience in conditions that aren't the typical 'home' conditions of your country, hiring specialist coaches, getting guys to play overseas domestix (and that's not to mention the more admin-y things like selection, competition structures etc.)

Like, think back to when Australia seemed significantly less phased by overseas conditions -- in broad terms the 'Gabba swung and seamed, Sydney turned, Adelaide was flat, Perth bounced. Melbourne was...rainy (or something). Wasn't perfect, sure, but the most experienced Test bat was far less likely to be a complete spud against spin, and the entire line-up was far less likely to completely crap itself whenever a ball moved off the straight.