Test XI for The Last Quarter Century

[TheJediBrah]

I can't support anyone picking Pollock. He's a ginger. It's unconscionable.

 

[srbhkshk]

I can't support anyone picking Pollock. He's a ginger. It's unconscionable.

fine.

Tendulkar
Jayasuriya
Kohli
Ponting
ABD
Dhoni
Klusener
Pollock (Hair dyed black)
Akram
Murali
McGrath

 

[Mr Miyagi]

fine.

Tendulkar
Jayasuriya
Kohli
Ponting
ABD
Dhoni
Klusener
Pollock (Hair dyed black)
Akram
Murali
McGrath

 

[Jack1]

Debatable re Bevan.

Better re Dhoni.

Still nowhere near Buttler. He is reinventing the script. He really is. Like it or not. He is so not English. He is like Neil Fairbrother mixed with steroids and meth.

I have Tendulkar and Kohli. Should keep most of the powers that be happy :P

To be honest, Bumrah is the next BCCI player on my list in place of Arkram. Yeah.

Kid is like Malinga 2.0. Uglier, worse haircut, but much improved. Akream is on the chopping block if Bumrah keeps it up over 5 more years.

Dhoni is really overrated, his strike rate is pretty horrendous. He scores way too slow in pressure situations. Buttler and Gilchrist are way better options as keeper.

Bevan has a super low career strike rate. Batsmen are way more skilled now than they were in limited overs cricket. Comparing eras isn’t a problem for me with batsmen. They simply weren’t as good or innovative in odi cricket in other eras. The batsmen are just simply more skilled with t20 cricket having been about for a while. The game is played differently now and the all time bowlers aren’t as good as their stars suggest either and are easier to hit than it would seem on paper.

As for my team, people saying it only has two strong batsman are taking the piss a bit considering it has Kohli, AbD, Watson, Gilchrist, Buttler, Maxwell, Russell, Pollock, Rashid Khan in it. My team has a career average of well above 300, so there’s no chance it’s going to collapse often against any attack.

Of course it should be realised in practice these teams have a squad and dropping players would and could occur to change strategy. I could have another anchor player in their like Tendulkar at opener, but as an opponent I’d be more fearful of a super aggressive team.

As for Rashid Khan his stats can’t really be argued with. He could play like garbage for an age now and still finish with incredible career stats. Batsmen are a lot better at working the ball about and hitting boundaries in this era. It would be wrong of me not to pick him.

All opinions as we can’t put anything to the test lol

 

[Mr Miyagi]

Dhoni is really overrated, his strike rate is pretty horrendous. He scores way too slow in pressure situations. Buttler and Gilchrist are way better options as keeper.

Bevan has a super low career strike rate. Batsmen are way more skilled now than they were in limited overs cricket. Comparing eras isn’t a problem for me with batsmen. They simply weren’t as good or innovative in odi cricket in other eras. The batsmen are just simply more skilled with t20 cricket having been about for a while. The game is played differently now and the all time bowlers aren’t as good as their stars suggest either and are easier to hit than it would seem on paper.

As for my team, people saying it only has two strong batsman are taking the piss a bit considering it has Kohli, AbD, Watson, Gilchrist, Buttler, Maxwell, Russell, Pollock, Rashid Khan in it. My team has a career average of well above 300, so there’s no chance it’s going to collapse often against any attack.

Of course it should be realised in practice these teams have a squad and dropping players would and could occur to change strategy. I could have another anchor player in their like Tendulkar at opener, but as an opponent I’d be more fearful of a super aggressive team.

As for Rashid Khan his stats can’t really be argued with. He could play like garbage for an age now and still finish with incredible career stats. Batsmen are a lot better at working the ball about and hitting boundaries in this era. It would be wrong of me not to pick him.

All opinions as we can’t put anything to the test lol

Dude, please save me going back - what is your team. Repost the the XI. I liked your post by the way. Some very good reasoning in there that I agree with wholeheartedly.

 

[OverratedSanity]

Batsmen are way more skilled now than they were in limited overs cricket. Comparing eras isn’t a problem for me with batsmen. They simply weren’t as good or innovative in odi cricket in other eras. The batsmen are just simply more skilled with t20 cricket having been about for a while. The game is played differently now and the all time bowlers aren’t as good as their stars suggest either and are easier to hit than it would seem on paper.

Rubbish. It's just different, not more skilled. End over hitting has gotten way easier because of powerplays and the ridiculous bats, while the skill in rotating the strike has almost completely disappeared due to the boundary reliant nature of ODI batting.

 

[Mr Miyagi]

Rubbish. It's just different, not more skilled. End over hitting has gotten way easier because of powerplays and the ridiculous bats, while the skill in rotating the strike has almost completely disappeared due to the boundary reliant nature of ODI batting.

As Ponting and the laws of physics says, range hitting as everyone emulated Kluesner post 1999 (that is practising 6 hitting on ground sizes) and especially in t20 made the biggest change. Bats are still subject to physics, and the GN scoop with its bigger edges was brilliantly balanced as used by the Chapell brothers back in the 1970's.


I can find references if you want.

 

[Daemon]

Einstein was not as good a physicist as the vast majority of PhD students today

 

[smash84]

Tendulkar
Gilchrist
Ponting
Kohli
ABdV
Symonds
Watson
Klusener
Wasim Akram
Muralitharan
McGrath


Rest of squad: Flintoff, Dhoni, Bond, Warne

Left out Bevan in the end even though he probably should be in there, just too hard to compare between eras

edit: Also would have put Lee in for Wasim but didn't want to be to Aus-heavy, but Lee hasn't been talked about enough in this thread. An underrated ODI ATG, deadly with the new ball.

What? Lee over Akram? Lee might not even make a 2nd ATXI.

 

[trundler]

Rashin Khan has mostly played against Associates though. He's terrific but I'm going to wait. Cant be too sure that these players aren't going to **** everything up.
And Bumrah is good too but I'm not putting him up there. Akram was perfect for limited overs cricket because of the variety he had. Pretty entertaining too. Bumrah is a promising bloke but there's others too like Hasan Ali and Mitchel Starc.

@John1990, I'm not disputing your logic. For an ODI, you want a team that scores 350+ often but the problem is your selection. A high strike rate wont contribute much if the bloke is going to last 5 balls.
Lastly, I don't think a McGrath or a Garner would be just good bowlers today. The thing with McGrath was his intelligence and adaptability. He was extremely accurate (Garner too) and I say he could've landed 60 yorkers on the trot if he wanted to. Garner was just unplayable at times so I don't think his ER would be affected too much. Not fair to say they'd be just normal blokes today imo. I picked these 2 as examples because they're the best imo.

 

[Mr Miyagi]

Einstein was not as good a physicist as the vast majority of PhD students today

Physics doesn't change, even if tech which realises what it is does - and the tech of the GN scoop, well its still good today. Even if you liked SS, GM DF or Kookaburra more.

 

[Mr Miyagi]

Rashin Khan has mostly played against Associates though. He's terrific but I'm going to wait. Cant be too sure that these players aren't going to **** everything up.
And Bumrah is good too but I'm not putting him up there. Akram was perfect for limited overs cricket because of the variety he had. Pretty entertaining too. Bumrah is a promising bloke but there's others too like Hasan Ali and Mitchel Starc.

@John1990, I'm not disputing your logic. For an ODI, you want a team that scores 350+ often but the problem is your selection. A high strike rate wont contribute much if the bloke is going to last 5 balls.
Lastly, I don't think a McGrath or a Garner would be just good bowlers today. The thing with McGrath was his intelligence and adaptability. He was extremely accurate (Garner too) and I say he could've landed 60 yorkers on the trot if he wanted to. Garner was just unplayable at times so I don't think his ER would be affected too much. Not fair to say they'd be just normal blokes today imo. I picked these 2 as examples because they're the best imo.

Like John1990, this is good post. Imo, you're both reasonable (bar the 60 yorkers, that too much for Garner, Bumrah, Starc or Malinga) and I aint seen John's team yet - how many batters are only going to last 5 balls? Is it full of B McCullums or something?:

May I counter that if you have Murali (and Akram who you like) and better batting than Garner or McGrath, taking Pollock over McGrath or Garner to bat 9 is reasonable also. :P

You really cannot compare the batting of Akram to Garner or McGrath let alone Pollock.

 

[trundler]

Yeah, well. Trundler's going to be hard for McGrath. But I still think McGrath would've outwitted and outsmarted even Kohli and ABDV.

 

[Mr Miyagi]

Yeah, well. Trundler's going to be hard for McGrath. But I still think McGrath would've outwitted and outsmarted even Kohli and ABDV.

Really? Cos metronomic line and legnth is such a problem for him :P McGrath 2.0 aka Hazlewood just called ABdV the best bat he has ever bowled to on the Back Page this week. What is McGrath going to do, swing it? :P

 

[trundler]

Like John1990, this is good post. Imo, you're both reasonable (bar the 60 yorkers, that too much for Garner, Bumrah, Starc or Malinga) and I aint seen John's team yet - how many batters are only going to last 5 balls? Is it full of B McCullums or something?:

May I counter that if you have Murali (and Akram who you like) and better batting than Garner or McGrath, taking Pollock over McGrath or Garner to bat 9 is reasonable also. :P

You really cannot compare the batting of Akram to Garner or McGrath let alone Pollock.

I have Pollock at 8, and Akram at 9 in my last 25 years team so the batting isn't an issue. Now, in an all time XI, I dunno.

 

[Mr Miyagi]

I have Pollock at 8, and Akram at 9 in my last 25 years team so the batting isn't an issue. Now, in an all time XI, I dunno.

I have Pollock at 9 and Akram and 10.

List your XI, I wanna compare batting and bowling :P

 

[trundler]

Really? Cos metronomic line and legnth is such a problem for him :P McGrath 2.0 aka Hazlewood just called ABdV the best bat he has ever bowled to on the Back Page this week. What is McGrath going to do, swing it? :P

Nah, Saffers choke under pressure and McGrath outperforms any other bowler in tournament finals.

 

[Mr Miyagi]

Nah, Saffers choke under pressure and McGrath outperforms any other bowler in tournament finals.

ABdV doesn't choke where regular Saffers do :P

He is limited by his team mates.

Akram has the best WC final for any any fast bowler (and that is the only bowler McGrath was competing with in my team as Murali spins #batbetter)

 

[OverratedSanity]

Really? Cos metronomic line and legnth is such a problem for him :P McGrath 2.0 aka Hazlewood just called ABdV the best bat he has ever bowled to on the Back Page this week. What is McGrath going to do, swing it? :P

This is a terrible post if you'r serious.

 

[Bolo]

Thanks.

Okay - Buttler - first time I have ever thought of him for an ATG side. His SR is off the hook and his average is good. I want that over Dhoni - his contemporary in the middle order- any day of the week with a long tail. (Gilly doesn't get past de Kock imo (setting a trend is legendary and a good artist and all but great artists steal).

Watson - has a great average in the middle order, but still less than Amla and Tendulkar, so he doesn't get to open, (but I would open Watson in t20 only), but in 50 overs he has time to get set, he has shown this previously. ATG.

I don't have Watson and Kluesner as 5th bowler, I have six bowling options and this does add value to any captain. It also covers for injury or bad days. Yes they're rfm, I want a better second spinner, but Jayasuriya aint knocking out Amla or Tnedulkar just yet. Do i need 7 bowling options at the expense of Tendulkar or Amla? Only in Asia at best.

Bevan = no, too slow. (I like his bowling option, though).

Dhoni = no, too slow. I'd have de Kock let alone Buttler both over him. Sorry BCCI. I have seen many a Dhoni six, and I have seen many a Dhoni defensive prod at the wrong time.

McGrath was in my first selected team. But after I dropped Cairns for Flintoff in the lower middle order, I realised that Pollock was good at #9 and as you said " a glitch in the matrix for McGrath", but with much better batting so I dropped McGrath before Akram. So as you say it is batting at 9 with Polly or McGrath's batting, sorry but my team bats to 9 and has 6 genuine bowlers. My weakness - as conceded is the second spinner where Teundulkar is the best. But I could easily swap Akram for Warne where required in Asia. And have 4 fm and 2 spin plus Tendulkar.

beat it

Buttler was the real surprise for me. He has come so far in the last 3 years. So very far. He just wasn't in my reckoning for ATG until recently. But those numbers are damn impressive. Damn impressive.

Buttler hasn't played enough for me to include him. His stats may nosedive. Add Starc to your team for consistency in selection approach if you don't see this as an issue. Additionally, he has only played in the era in which strike rates have exploded. His stats era adjusted are a bit better than Gilchrists, but not much. Dhoni has been playing a while- his strike rate is ok. Same stats as Amla, but I think he scores tougher runs. Plus he brings it by keeping and being an awesome captain.

Watson averages 45 when opening and low 30s when not (only about 10 50s).

6 bowlers adds value, yes. Significant value considering their similarity, probably not. Pick Symonds instead if you want to go this route. Much better fielder and middle order bat, and the quality of his bowling will be compensated for (wholly or partly) by the variety.

Pick Ponting if you think Bevan is too slow.

I can't really argue McGrath above Flintoff. It's just preference in team balance, on which we differ- there isn't a definitive answer.