Lessons for indian team after the indo-pak test series

[SJS]

TBF they did promote Kumble ahead of even Pathan in the last innings. Btw he tops the batting averages for the Indian team with 95.00!

too late.

even in the first innings if his and laxmans partnership had been for the 8th wicket rather than the last, things may, just may, have been a bit different.

 

[SJS]

Another lesson, I hope they learn though not too sure.

Persist with a successful opening pair and they will give you good starts more and more regularly.
113 & 85, 80 & 14, 98 & 87.
These are the starts Gambhir and Sehwag gave to India but one can already hear some idiots talking of Gambhir not converting his starts into big scores. Yuvraj has again said that he will open if the selectors want him to.

A team's fate is also determined by its selection policies.

 

[Arjun]

I wouldnt go as far as to say that !

He was an understudy and nothing more- that he got pushed into the role of strike bowler way too soon proved highly counter-productive. He should be dropped an kept out for a really, really long time until he starts getting wickets and runs for Baroda.

Another lesson, I hope they learn though not too sure.

Persist with a successful opening pair and they will give you good starts more and more regularly.
113 & 85, 80 & 14, 98 & 87.
These are the starts Gambhir and Sehwag gave to India but one can already hear some idiots talking of Gambhir not converting his starts into big scores. Yuvraj has again said that he will open if the selectors want him to.

A team's fate is also determined by its selection policies.

Totally agree with you on that. Maybe you too can tell Madan Lal what's important. Out of all the openers picked for India, Gambhir and to a lesser extent Chopra looked good enough for an Indian top six. Gambhir's shot selection needs a little fine-tuning, but his intent is good. He should just rotate the strike and let Sehwag attack the pacers, while he attacks the spinners.

Surely, Kumbles straight bat does not impress skipper Ganguly as do Harbhajans chopper shots.

He has batted at numbers 9, 10 and 11 for years, and has made little use of his experience as a batsman when he would come out to bat. In the recent past, he seemed devoid of any batting ability, and got out in really awkward positions. His running between the wickets is terrible. The less said of his ODI batting, the better.

Boycott has slammed Kumble's lack of batting ability ("Kumble can't bat! Simple as that!") but has praised Pathan ("He's got some potential") and has hope in him ("He could become a different all-rounder, with one skill stronger than the other"), and being one of the most consistent opening batsmen of all time, he has a point. Then again, Pathan was, and still is, just raw material, and not the finished product.

Besides, Kumble won't play too many ODI's.

Test Side: Gambhir, Sehwag, Dravid (c), Tendulkar, Laxman, Kaif, Karthik, Pathan/Nehra, Kumble, Harbhajan, Balaji/Zaheer ... hopefully this forces Ganguly to fix his batting

Dinesh Karthik? Are you serious? You've got no great wicketkeeper-batsman, just another Deep Dasgupta! There's no way he can make an Indian XI on batting or keeping, when there are better wicketkeepers around for either role- Dharmani and Dhoni are better batsmen, while Samant and Ratra are better keepers!

Zaheer must return. He's far more seasoned than the others picked ahead of him. If he can do what he did throughout 2002, in Tests and ODI's- stay fit and bowl the ball in the right pace- he can perform a lot better than any of those others.

 

[shankar]

Another lesson, I hope they learn though not too sure.

Persist with a successful opening pair and they will give you good starts more and more regularly.
113 & 85, 80 & 14, 98 & 87.
These are the starts Gambhir and Sehwag gave to India but one can already hear some idiots talking of Gambhir not converting his starts into big scores. Yuvraj has again said that he will open if the selectors want him to.

A team's fate is also determined by its selection policies.

Do you think Gambhir has potential to be a good opener SJS? He's been getting starts, but I feel that if he doesnt correct his tendency to keep plonking his front foot across the stumps, he'll be a sitting duck against better bowling attacks.

 

[SJS]

Do you think Gambhir has potential to be a good opener SJS? He's been getting starts, but I feel that if he doesnt correct his tendency to keep plonking his front foot across the stumps, he'll be a sitting duck against better bowling attacks.

I agree with that observation.

He also has this bad habit of trying to run down the ball off the face of the bat as if he were playing in a limited over game with no slips. Ganguly does the same. It is the worst habit picked up by many batsmen from the limited overs but somehow left handers are bigger culprits.

But when he doesnt do that and does move back and across, he playes pretty well of the back foot which is a pre requisite for openers. But you are right he does have this tendency to go across on his front foot. A good opener should, by and large, with the exception of wickets that keep low, go forward only if they can get close to the ball otherwise stay back in defense.

But we dont yet see another alternative at the moment and he cant be replaced with another front foot player like Yuvraj whose strengths are totally different. And you cant argue with success.

 

[Arjun]

Boycott said that Gambhir gets his front foot across the wrong side of the ball far too often, so his leg-side play needs work.

 

[SJS]

Boycott said that Gambhir gets his front foot across the wrong side of the ball far too often, so his leg-side play needs work.

Would it be less true if Boycott hadnt said it ?

 

[Arjun]

Would it be less true if Boycott hadnt said it ?

Boycott is very much a father figure for Indian cricket, particularly because he was a consultant at the National Cricket Academy in Bangalore.

 

[SJS]

But if,
Gambhir gets his front foot across the wrong side of the ball far too often,
cant you see it for yourself and make the observation. How does Boycotts saying so make it more authentic than what you can see for yourself ??

 

[Behlol]

i think the indians should only learn that pakistan is inexperienced but good enough to beat any team!

 

[kendall]

i think the indians should only learn that pakistan is inexperienced but good enough to beat any team!

NO! NO! NO! NO!
another ridiculous comment, they are not good enough to beat everyone, they can barely beat bangladesh once, they can be good on their day, but they cannot beat the aussies, and i very much dobt they could beat england over a 5 match series.

 

[krishneelz]

How can you tell a quality player to learn to play under pressure or be axed? Firstly every innings at the top level against Test standard teams is under pressure. Secondly, some players handle pressure well and others don't. Steve Waugh didn't learn to be a pressure player, he just was. Only a fool would drop Sachin Tendulkar based on his seeming tendency to fail in some pressure situations. That first innings hundred "under no pressure" could win you the game.

well said mxyzptlk

 

[honestbharani]

Maybe u guys should take a look at the other thread started by SJS. And Arjun, please cut this Kaarthick is not good crap. Even Boycott (you seem to adore him) said that he looks very good as a keeper and should just work on contributing more consistently with the bat. He is learning all the time, and I think over this series, he has definitely improved.

 

[Arjun]

Maybe u guys should take a look at the other thread started by SJS. And Arjun, please cut this Kaarthick is not good crap. Even Boycott (you seem to adore him) said that he looks very good as a keeper and should just work on contributing more consistently with the bat. He is learning all the time, and I think over this series, he has definitely improved.

What great thing has Karthik done to stay in the side? His keeping has been suspect and he's been found wanting keeping to spinners. Even before he made his ODI debut, some said he needs to improve his keeping- that itself was a frightful indication of what the bowlers would be in for, having struggled with Parthiv and Dravid. As for his batting, that's not good enough for an India top-6, or even to replace Yuvraj Singh. Like Pathan, he too is just the raw material and not yet the finished product.

 

[honestbharani]

So, exactly what finished products are you talking about? And how much they have been tested against Kumble and Bhajji? You have to understand that aside from Murali, these are the two most difficult spinners to keep to, esp. in India. And when the whole team management seem to think he is doing well, why should he be dropped? This is not musical chairs, for God's sake. And, as I often say, the natural talent and the attitude are two very important issues with any player and with Kaarthick, I think he is fine on both counts and I think he can go on to be a successful player for India, as long as shotgun selection supporters like you don't have ur way.

 

[vvk]

Karthick needs to go and work on his keeping AND batting. Dhoni needs to come in as he can also hold his own as a batsman.

Gambhir has also been found wanting against the test level - he failed to take advantage of starts against both the South Africans and Pakistan, both being series in favorable home batting conditions.

I say - Yuvraj Singh should be tried at the top of the order, and Kaif replacing Ganguly in the middle order.

 

[shoot_me]

What great thing has Karthik done to stay in the side? His keeping has been suspect and he's been found wanting keeping to spinners. Even before he made his ODI debut, some said he needs to improve his keeping- that itself was a frightful indication of what the bowlers would be in for, having struggled with Parthiv and Dravid. As for his batting, that's not good enough for an India top-6, or even to replace Yuvraj Singh. Like Pathan, he too is just the raw material and not yet the finished product.

well what the crap did Parthiv Patel ever do to stay in the side for 19 tests? NOTHING. Therefore, it's injustice to drop Karthik who has already played a mature and selfless innings. Everyone knows this guy has talent, he just needs a confidence boost. Maybe it's because I'm used to watching a keeper of parthiv patel's standards, but karthik is good behind the stumps. He hasnt dropped one catch or miss a single stumping during the india-pak test series. Some keep saying Dhoni should be in the test squad but from what i've heard, he's a great ODI player but not fit for tests.

 

[honestbharani]

well what the crap did Parthiv Patel ever do to stay in the side for 19 tests? NOTHING. Therefore, it's injustice to drop Karthik who has already played a mature and selfless innings. Everyone knows this guy has talent, he just needs a confidence boost. Maybe it's because I'm used to watching a keeper of parthiv patel's standards, but karthik is good behind the stumps. He hasnt dropped one catch or miss a single stumping during the india-pak test series. Some keep saying Dhoni should be in the test squad but from what i've heard, he's a great ODI player but not fit for tests.

Even if Dhoni was the next Gilchrist, I still don't see how it is fair to Kaarthick to drop him when he is doing reasonably well. He should only be dropped when he performs badly and till now, he hasn't performed 'badly' and that is what matters.

 

[SJS]

Even if Dhoni was the next Gilchrist, I still don't see how it is fair to Kaarthick to drop him when he is doing reasonably well. He should only be dropped when he performs badly and till now, he hasn't performed 'badly' and that is what matters.

HB,

It doesnt matter what you think. What matters is what "the coach" thinks

 

[Richard]

If someone should be axed from the test team, it is Ganguly. As much as I want Ganguly to do well and keep his place in the team, there is no room for such pathetic performances when we could have a more consistent, energetic and athletic guy like Kaif in the side in his place. Pathan seriously needs to be rested for a match or two so he can sort things out and perhaps improve his fitness (if that is the problem). He won't be able to do too much damage the way he's bowling right now.

Test Side: Gambhir, Sehwag, Dravid (c), Tendulkar, Laxman, Kaif, Karthik, Pathan/Nehra, Kumble, Harbhajan, Balaji/Zaheer ... hopefully this forces Ganguly to fix his batting

I just cannot fail to be amazed at how many people want Kaif in the Test-side.
I mean, yes, Ganguly can't keep playing when he's scoring like this, but come on... there must be heaps of players better than Mohammad Kaif who can be brought in?