Jonbrooks chucking Megathread

[Migara]

Also please bowl a few deliveries medium pace, spin and doosra. See how the elbow is used. You will understand how the doosra uses extra force of the elbow while a clean medium pace or spin action doesn't. I don't know why it's so difficult to understand the throw. It's common sense more than any thing.

For me the maximum use of elbow is for the yorker and the bouncer. I get a sore elbow after bowling few of them. I can bowl a doosra, but the soreness is no where close to bowling quick.

 

[Pratters]

Now, all bowlers use the elbow extension to bowl except Ramnaresh Sarwan. Now show above statement is wrong with whatever evidence you have. No subjective drivel please.

That's where they made wrong changes in the law.

 

[TheJediBrah]

Pratters is being an idiot and isnt worth engaging with anymore. TheJediBrah, who was coming from the same angle seems a lot more sensible:



Well yea. But thats doesn't mean its chucking. If a bowler can bowl a doosra that has more flexion of the elbow relative to his offbreak, but less than what other quick bowlers or spinners obtain, then should he still be called a chucker? If so, then why? It doesn't seem fair that one bowler gets to leverage his elbow more than another, simply because he bowls in a more orthodox style or manner.

Similar to how the 'if it looks like a chuck, it must be a chuck' argument is not fair, saying the doosra should be banned because it requires the practitioner to straighten his elbow more than he would for his stock ball is also not fair. This is why we have rules like the 15 degree rule in place.

I never said it was. You're confusing me with Pratters.

 

[Pratters]

For me the maximum use of elbow is for the yorker and the bouncer. I get a sore elbow after bowling few of them. I can bowl a doosra, but the soreness is no where close to bowling quick.

You must be chucking them or maybe you are not powerful or maybe you are bowling them wrongly. Bouncers and Yorkers can be bowled without chucking them though.

 

[honestbharani]

Everyone seems to think Doosra is just elbow work. But it is a lot more about the work you can put on the ball from your wrists. Perhaps why the SC bowlers find it easier to bowl, given how "wristly" SC batsmen are always claimed to be.

 

[Migara]

you can't bowl the doosra without straightening the elbow, it's physically impossible.

Bowling without elbow extension is only for Sarwan. It's physically impossible to bowl without using the elbow.

 

[TheJediBrah]

If someone can bowl a doosra with <15 degrees, it's legal. It's hard to do though.

 

[Pratters]

Everyone seems to think Doosra is just elbow work. But it is a lot more about the work you can put on the ball from your wrists. Perhaps why the SC bowlers find it easier to bowl, given how "wristly" SC batsmen are always claimed to be.

No. Technique of the doosra is where the problem is.

 

[Migara]

i am a legspinner and i'm just wondering, how does a leggie chuck it?

Slider my boy slider.

 

[OverratedSanity]

Ah I see what you are saying. Yeah I was exaggerating a bit regarding the sore elbow.

But an increased flexion of the elbow is ubiquitous with bowling of the doosra. It's just the physiology of the movement. It's much easier to bowl an off-break, leg-break or a medium-pace delivery with less flexion than a doosra.

Yeah I can agree with that, certainly, but I don't see that as much more different than the effort ball which so many fast bowlers bowl. It's easier to bowl a normal stock good length outswinger with less flexion than it is to bowl a head high 150 kph bouncer. I don't know if Walsh chucked his effort ball, but it looked worse, atleast to me, than Murali's doosras. Now why do we pile so much crap on Murali and not on Walsh? Sounds inconsistent to me.

 

[cnerd123]

You must be chucking them or maybe you are not powerful or maybe you are bowling them wrongly. Bouncers and Yorkers can be bowled without chucking them though.

Lmao

Pratters: My elbow is sore when I bowl doosras. Must be impossible to bowl without chucking
Me: You are doing it wrong.
Pratters: Nuh uh.

Miagara: My elbow is sore when I bowl fast. Must be impossible to do without chucking
Pratters: You are doing it wrong

 

[honestbharani]

That's where they made wrong changes in the law.

That's very objective. ICC should just take Pratters' word on everything about bowling from now on. Maybe at least it will save us such tedious threads on a New Years' weekend.


Its like we have our own even more tedious and intolerable and less lovable version of Sheldon Cooper.

 

[Pratters]

Lmao

Pratters: My elbow is sore when I bowl doosras. Must be impossible to bowl without chucking
Me: You are doing it wrong.
Pratters: Nuh uh.

Miagara: My elbow is sore when I bowl fast. Must be impossible to do without chucking
Pratters: You are doing it wrong

Maybe because a lot of bowlers have shown it's possible to bowl a Yorker or bouncer without chucking it?

 

[honestbharani]

Maybe because a lot of bowlers have shown it's possible to bowl a Yorker or bouncer without chucking it?

Who?

 

[TheJediBrah]

Yeah I can agree with that, certainly, but I don't see that as much more different than the effort ball which so many fast bowlers bowl. It's easier to bowl a normal stock good length outswinger with less flexion than it is to bowl a head high 150 kph bouncer. I don't know if Walsh chucked his effort ball, but it looked worse, atleast to me, than Murali's doosras. Now why do we pile so much crap on Murali and not on Walsh? Sounds inconsistent to me.

It's not. You see that so much in local cricket too. It's disgusting.

 

[Pratters]

That's very objective. ICC should just take Pratters' word on everything about bowling from now on. Maybe at least it will save us such tedious threads on a New Years' weekend.


Its like we have our own even more tedious and intolerable and less lovable version of Sheldon Cooper.

I am not the only one who believes this though.

 

[honestbharani]

I am not the only one who believes this though.

Its what they all say...

 

[Pratters]

Who?

Haha.

 

[Migara]

I missed that os. Velocity at elbow limits would mean doosra for murali and every one else who bowls it would be outlawed.

How do you know that a bouncer would produce lesser extension? Out of the arse argument, unfortunately.

 

[Pratters]

Its what they all say...

Holding, Bedi, SJS, Faaip, a few other cw posters think the law wasn't ammended properly at the time. So I am not the only one who believes this. Cheers.