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England players and selection discussion thread

kevinw

U19 Cricketer
Dawson not even in the Lions squad. Not that I'm a huge fan particularly, but neither can I see what Patterson-White and Carson have done to get in ahead of him. At least Dawson has been playing Div 1 cricket.
LPW, I understand. Carson's been getting the coach fired more than actually playing ;)

Decent Lions squad actually. Mostly young guys you could see playing international cricket rather than older, 'not quite good enough' filler.
 

Blenkinsop

U19 12th Man
The Lions squad seems a bit strange to me. The two-division structure is supposed to increase standards in the county game, yet only six out of the 15 have been playing Div 1 this year. Jack Carson and Rehan Ahmed played just three matches each, both in Div 2. Carson took five wickets at the princely average of 47. Ahmed averaged 30 with the ball but then so did Matt Parkinson, except in his case it was over ten matches in Div 1. Dan Lawrence had a terrible season.

Tom Lawes and Gus Atkinson both had good seasons and helped Surrey win their title, why are they not in the squad? And where is Ben Compton?
 

Prince EWS

Global Moderator
Dawson not even in the Lions squad. Not that I'm a huge fan particularly, but neither can I see what Patterson-White and Carson have done to get in ahead of him. At least Dawson has been playing Div 1 cricket.
I was surprised Dawson wasn't in the Test squad but I don't think there's a lot of value in picking him in the Lions squad if they've moved on from on. Carson and Patterson-White are much younger so it could help them develop.
 

theegyptian

International Vice-Captain
So 50 over wc in India less than a year to go. ODI series starting vs Australia tomorrow.


Looking forwrad to the WC

Openers. Bairstow and Roy/Hales/Malan.
Bairstow nailed on. Ideally England would prefer Roy to regain his form as the Bairstow/Roy combination has proved so profitable. If not Roy? Hales would have his fans but he doesn't play 50 over or championship cricket and technically he was never the greatest so I have my doubts about that. Malan hasn't played much ODI cricket but I wouldn't mind him seeing him at the top of the order for the WC if Roy continues to struggle. Decent technically, left handed to compliment the top order right handers.

Middle order.
Root and Buttler definites. Ali, Livingstone, SCurran all in the squad. With Morgan and Stokes retired opportunities for another middle order bat potentially. Duckett has improved and good against spin. Would offer a left hand bat in the middle order to replace the absent Morgan and Stokes, and a contrast in style to the rest of the batsman.

Bowling.
Would love to get Archer back. Wood hopefully fit. Woakes hasn't been great since returning from injury in t20 (lacking bite with the new ball?) but a consistent performer in 50 over. Rashid. Topley, Willey and Mahmood competing for final spots in squad. Dawson as reserve spinner because he's always there?

Potential Squad - Bairstow, Roy, Malan, Root, Buttler, Ali, Livingstone, Woakes, Archer, Wood, Rashid, (Duckett, Topley, SCurran, Dawson)
 

Red_Ink_Squid

International Captain
So 50 over wc in India less than a year to go. ODI series starting vs Australia tomorrow.


Looking forwrad to the WC

Openers. Bairstow and Roy/Hales/Malan.
Bairstow nailed on. Ideally England would prefer Roy to regain his form as the Bairstow/Roy combination has proved so profitable. If not Roy? Hales would have his fans but he doesn't play 50 over or championship cricket and technically he was never the greatest so I have my doubts about that. Malan hasn't played much ODI cricket but I wouldn't mind him seeing him at the top of the order for the WC if Roy continues to struggle. Decent technically, left handed to compliment the top order right handers.

Middle order.
Root and Buttler definites. Ali, Livingstone, SCurran all in the squad. With Morgan and Stokes retired opportunities for another middle order bat potentially. Duckett has improved and good against spin. Would offer a left hand bat in the middle order to replace the absent Morgan and Stokes, and a contrast in style to the rest of the batsman.

Bowling.
Would love to get Archer back. Wood hopefully fit. Woakes hasn't been great since returning from injury in t20 (lacking bite with the new ball?) but a consistent performer in 50 over. Rashid. Topley, Willey and Mahmood competing for final spots in squad. Dawson as reserve spinner because he's always there?

Potential Squad - Bairstow, Roy, Malan, Root, Buttler, Ali, Livingstone, Woakes, Archer, Wood, Rashid, (Duckett, Topley, SCurran, Dawson)
Agree with pretty much all of that. Expect Salt and Brook will be competing for places too, though I prefer your call of Duckett. (Probably too late for Vince?)

Feels weird that since the 2019 WC win we've played so little ODI cricket, and even less with a first choice side. Huge swing after ODIs were prioritised so heavily in the 2015-2019 years. With the Hundred also relegating the domestic 50 over competition to County B sides I'd guess a lot of our top players will have barely played the format recently.
 

Ashes81

School Boy/Girl Captain
So 50 over wc in India less than a year to go. ODI series starting vs Australia tomorrow.


Looking forwrad to the WC

Openers. Bairstow and Roy/Hales/Malan.
Bairstow nailed on. Ideally England would prefer Roy to regain his form as the Bairstow/Roy combination has proved so profitable. If not Roy? Hales would have his fans but he doesn't play 50 over or championship cricket and technically he was never the greatest so I have my doubts about that. Malan hasn't played much ODI cricket but I wouldn't mind him seeing him at the top of the order for the WC if Roy continues to struggle. Decent technically, left handed to compliment the top order right handers.

Middle order.
Root and Buttler definites. Ali, Livingstone, SCurran all in the squad. With Morgan and Stokes retired opportunities for another middle order bat potentially. Duckett has improved and good against spin. Would offer a left hand bat in the middle order to replace the absent Morgan and Stokes, and a contrast in style to the rest of the batsman.

Bowling.
Would love to get Archer back. Wood hopefully fit. Woakes hasn't been great since returning from injury in t20 (lacking bite with the new ball?) but a consistent performer in 50 over. Rashid. Topley, Willey and Mahmood competing for final spots in squad. Dawson as reserve spinner because he's always there?

Potential Squad - Bairstow, Roy, Malan, Root, Buttler, Ali, Livingstone, Woakes, Archer, Wood, Rashid, (Duckett, Topley, SCurran, Dawson)
I don't think the squad will be too far away from that barring injuries.

Roy is obviously going to need to regain his form with Hales and even Salt in the frame.

Personally I've always preferred Hales to Roy in ODIs but Roy has his chance to reclaim his spot in the upcoming matches with Australia.
 

Prince EWS

Global Moderator
9 first class wickets...
Five of them came in one innings too, in which he went at over 4rpo and conceded over 100. Two of the wickets were #10 and #11 too, but he did also ton up in the match which is the most important attribute for your spinner to have, obvs.

You'd have to assume he has no real chance of actually playing and is just there 'for the experience'.
 

Starfighter

Hall of Fame Member
You'd have to assume he has no real chance of actually playing and is just there 'for the experience'.
A lot of the media chatter seems to suggest he does. He's the only other non-part time spinner in the squad, so if they want more spin than what Jacks/Livingstone/Root will provide in addition to Leach, they have to pick him.
 

Prince EWS

Global Moderator
A lot of the media chatter seems to suggest he does. He's the only other non-part time spinner in the squad, so if they want more spin than what Jacks/Livingstone/Root will provide in addition to Leach, they have to pick him.
Well they did pick the original squad without him. I think they intend on using Jacks. Quote from Baz doesn't really suggest they're looking to put him straight into the eleven either:

“We know he’s not the finished article and has raw potential,” said McCullum, who broke the news to Ahmed at tea. “But Ben, myself and the rest of the coaches like how he approaches his game. The experience of being part of the squad in Pakistan will be hugely beneficial for him, and he will add to the makeup of our squad.”

Lol @ him being picked based on a three-day practice game against the England team in which he took 0/73 off 8 overs!
 

Starfighter

Hall of Fame Member
Well they did pick the original squad without him. I think they intend on using Jacks. Quote from Baz doesn't really suggest they're looking to put him straight into the eleven either:

“We know he’s not the finished article and has raw potential,” said McCullum, who broke the news to Ahmed at tea. “But Ben, myself and the rest of the coaches like how he approaches his game. The experience of being part of the squad in Pakistan will be hugely beneficial for him, and he will add to the makeup of our squad.”

Lol @ him being picked based on a three-day practice game against the England team in which he took 0/73 off 8 overs!
Jacks is not any batter a choice FTR. McCullum certainly seems to dovetail very nicely into England's pre-existing attitude to spinners, which is rather depressing.
 

Socerer 01

U19 Captain
Jacks is not any batter a choice FTR. McCullum certainly seems to dovetail very nicely into England's pre-existing attitude to spinners, which is rather depressing.
on the other hand hasn’t he backed Leach adequately when the previous regime threw him to the wolves? just feels like he is being creative about the whole situation in a very Baz way
 

Chubb

International Debutant
Really hope Ahmed doesn’t play. Throwing young leg spinners into test cricket rarely works out well. If he plays and does okay that’s great but what are the chances?
 

Prince EWS

Global Moderator
Jacks is not any batter a choice FTR. McCullum certainly seems to dovetail very nicely into England's pre-existing attitude to spinners, which is rather depressing.
Yeah Jacks is a horrible selection. He's not even the best pick as a "batsman we're pretending is a spinner" option - that's Dawson. I assume he's only ahead of Dawson because he turns it the other way to Leach (although tbh he doesn't really turn it at all).
 

Starfighter

Hall of Fame Member
9 first class wickets...

Can't have been any specialist bowlers selected for a test tour on such slim evidence before?
Seales had played one first class match (taking 1/53 and 0/23) when he debuted for the West Indies, though that was a home series.
 

Blenkinsop

U19 12th Man
on the other hand hasn’t he backed Leach adequately when the previous regime threw him to the wolves? just feels like he is being creative about the whole situation in a very Baz way
Stokes has certainly captained Leach much better than Root ever did. Dunno how much of that was down to Baz tho.
 

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