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Drop Parthiv Patel , Select Dinesh Karthik
- Thread starter TruthTeller
- Start date
SJS
Hall of Fame Member
Possible but you cant be a mug with the bat and get a hundred much less stay on in a 2oo plus run partnership.V Reddy said:Maybe really terrible is an exaggeration but remove that hundred and look at the avg of the remaining innings , i doubt it would cross 10
Here are the first class averages of the keepers in India (the ones talked about or considered for India) over the last two years. The figures in brackets are the number victims (catches and stumpings) per match.
Murali Karthik : 41.1 (2.9)
MS Dhoni : 34.0 (3.7)
Ajay Ratra : 24.6 (3.1)
Parthiv Patel : 21.0 (2.5)
Deep Dasgupta : 16.7 (2.2)
Take the figures with as much salt as you want
TendulkarFan
School Boy/Girl Captain
As far as I'm concerned, they need to have a guy behind the stumps who can keep. I couldn't care less if the keeper batted at #11 and scored 0 each time, as long as he gets the likes of Ponting, Gilchrist & Hayden out at the first chance he gets. Wickets taken are always more valuable than runs scored.
As of right now, Patel isn't doing that. I don't know if Karthik is the man but this Gilchrist-obsession has to stop. If a second Gilchrist exists anywhere in India, he won't need any help rising to the top.
As of right now, Patel isn't doing that. I don't know if Karthik is the man but this Gilchrist-obsession has to stop. If a second Gilchrist exists anywhere in India, he won't need any help rising to the top.
TendulkarFan
School Boy/Girl Captain
Boy if Murali Karthik could do that I would drop Sachin Tendulkar for himSJS said:
Maybe you're talking about Dinesh Karthik?
SJS
Hall of Fame Member
TendulkarFan said:Boy if Murali Karthik could do that I would drop Sachin Tendulkar for him
Maybe you're talking about Dinesh Karthik?
By the way, there is a young (21 yr old) keeper who plays for MP. Averages 49.6 in first class matches in 2003-04.
Then there is Pankaj Dharmani of Punjab. He has the best batting credentials of all. Averaged 51.0 in FC games in 2002-3 and went one better in 2003-4 averaging 62.2 with a top score of 230 not out.
In all first class matches so far this 30 year old has scored over 6300 runs with 18 centuries, 18 fifties , a career average of 51.7 and a top score of 305 not out !!!
Take your pick of a full harvest of Indian keepers or stick to the few you get to hear of
TendulkarFan
School Boy/Girl Captain
SJS said:
Then there is Pankaj Dharmani of Punjab. He has the best batting credentials of all. Averaged 51.0 in FC games in 2002-3 and went one better in 2003-4 averaging 62.2 with a top score of 230 not out.
In all first class matches so far this 30 year old has scored over 6300 runs with 18 centuries, 18 fifties , a career average of 51.7 and a top score of 305 not out !!!
I've never really watched Dharmani play but have definitely seen his performances at Ranji level in ICC 2002
Certainly looks like a keeper.I do believe though that the reason that no other wicket keeper got a chance in 90's was because Mongia was just so strong at keeping and not too shabby a batsman too.
V Reddy
International Debutant
Nice work dudeSJS said:
By the way, there is a young (21 yr old) keeper who plays for MP. Averages 49.6 in first class matches in 2003-04.
Then there is Pankaj Dharmani of Punjab. He has the best batting credentials of all. Averaged 51.0 in FC games in 2002-3 and went one better in 2003-4 averaging 62.2 with a top score of 230 not out.
In all first class matches so far this 30 year old has scored over 6300 runs with 18 centuries, 18 fifties , a career average of 51.7 and a top score of 305 not out !!!
Take your pick of a full harvest of Indian keepers or stick to the few you get to hear of
I am really surprised at Dasgupta's batting stats
. He was a clone of Chopra but unlike him was capable of getting past 50 which he showed in intl cricket. Yeah the case of Dharmani is a sad one. He only got to play in one match in the Titan Cup then he was selected for the SAF tour and got 2 50's in the 2 1st class games he played but never got a look in. I expected to see Ratra's avg in the 20's but i thought Dhoni avged much more than that as he is said to have scored a lot this season. I also saw that Century against Pak A which was shown on Ten Sports, he was unorthodox but looked a good batsman and is a good keeper too.
Neil Pickup
Cricket Web Moderator
If I remember rightly, that is Ratra's only noteworthy contribution in his Test career, and his average excluding that effort is in the region of ten.
That Antigua pitch was also resembled the M25, and by the end of day five it had got to the point where every single Indian, including Ratra, was bowling.
That Antigua pitch was also resembled the M25, and by the end of day five it had got to the point where every single Indian, including Ratra, was bowling.
SJS
Hall of Fame Member
Even I am surprised to see Das's batting stats. But he was easily the 'worst' keeper ever to play for India. At 54 I will do a better jobV Reddy said:Nice work dude
I am really surprised at Dasgupta's batting stats
I expected to see Ratra's avg in the 20's but i thought Dhoni avged much more than that as he is said to have scored a lot this season. I also saw that Century against Pak A which was shown on Ten Sports, he was unorthodox but looked a good batsman and is a good keeper too.
Ratra was no great bat. but as I said beofre we are talking keeping skills here. I refered to his century only because someone said he was 'terrible with bat in hand'. That sounded a BIT of an exaggeration.
I am told Dhoni is good but I havent seen him so I am reluctant to claim he is better or worse than so and so.
Dharmani was considered good enough once to play for India as a batsman alone. Some times it is a bit of a draw back to be a very good batsman and your keping is over shadowed by your batting. It gives critics an opportunity to say, 'oh but his keeping is not as good'. Shifting goal posts
I think we need to pick the best keeper from those we have for the tests and stick with him for a prolonged period. Pick the better batsman among them and use him for ODI's. And take both of them on tours together. This way we will develop two keepers and have variety as well.
From his stats he looks like the one of best wicketkeeper India ever produced but this guy has a average of 55.46 in Limited Overs with 4 centuries that tells a lot about this him plus hes only 23. http://uk.cricinfo.com/db/PLAYERS/IND/D/DHONI_MS_06007593/
honestbharani
Whatever it takes!!!
I know I keep coming back to this but what a coincidence it has been that ever since Kaarthick broke into the side, every time he has been dropped, India have lost. He seems to be our good luck charm.
Arjun
Cricketer Of The Year
Hmmm....Ganguly has two more wicketkeeping options in ODI's. If Dravid can be a regular ODI keeper, why not these two?
Sad indeed. The problem was that he started keeping at a late stage, and there was no way he could make the team as a batsman. At present, he is the best batsman among the keepers, but given his age and his late entry as a keeper, his chances of making the team as a keeper are slim.
I got to see him battign on Ten Sport, who covered the Indian A-team's ODI leg of the tour of Kenya. His batting is good, especially in ODI's, except that he bats a lot like Balaji (and even looks like him!) and is basically a slogger. Ultimately, he gets runs, and that's good. His keeping is still scratchy, but he holds on to catches and completes his stumpings.
He was the fastest keeper to play for the etam. His speed of action and reaction time were impressive, but his technique was not clean. That said, if he does his job behind the stumps, and builds partnerships with other batsmen, and gives the man from the top-6 support, he is a good selection, but must score more than 2 runs an innings.
In ODI's, fielding is a VERY important area, and that includes keeping. It does not matter how many runs are scored (ODI's have a lot of runs scored anyway) but how many are saved. They can pick average bowlers based on their batting or otherwise, but given strong fielding support, they are more effective- think Brad Williams or Nathan Bracken or Daryl Tuffey or Jacob Oram or Vaas or Zoysa.
masterblaster
International Captain
I'd still say Dinesh Karthik is the best technical gloveman in India behind Nayan Mongia. Ratra is quick as Arjun states, but his batting is a let down unfortunately. Dhoni looks like a good prospect, but if he fumbles like Parthiv and Dasgupta, he'll be blacklisted forever as well.