4th Test (Old Trafford, Manchester) - 23rd to 27th of July

[jaydesh]

Liam Dawson could be a pretty handy option as a spinner, as well as his competence with the bat. That said, it's a shame England have failed to find a consistent test spinner since Swanny and Monty Panesar. I can name many who have been tried but either haven't been given a long enough run, had fitness issues, or were bang average at best for international standards: Moeen Ali, Adil Rashid, Dawson, Dom Bess, Jack Leach, Mason Crane, Shoaib Bashir (given Stokes's backing, he should slot right back in), Tom Hartley, Rehan Ahmed (but these days you'd find him opening the batting at Grace Road), etc.

The only long term option I see at the moment is Jacob Bethell, considering 35 isn't necessarily always a kind age to return to the fold in test cricket for Liam Dawson.

 

[jaydesh]

Chris Woakes has a strong record at Old Trafford Cricket Ground, particularly in Test matches. In Tests, he has an impressive average of 17.37, with 27 wickets in 6 matches played. In ODIs, he has taken 8 wickets at the venue. His performances at Old Trafford include a five-wicket haul that helped England secure a series win and a crucial 84 not out in a Test win against Pakistan.


now that may see Woakes retained

Very true. But at the moment, he seems to be living on past reputation, in the sense that he is getting picked for the bowler and batter he was a few years ago. Not to mention his fitness issues as of late, but England probably won't care about that right now. It's not like they'll select him for Australia anyway, given he will be reduced to a harmless trundler there.

If he is dropped, the only thing they might miss is his general discipline with line and length. Atkinson is a really good bowler/lower order batter, but he can be streaky at times with the new ball.

 

[Pothas]

So pleased for Dawson. Massively deserves it.

 

[LangleyburyCCPlayer]

Liam Dawson could be a pretty handy option as a spinner, as well as his competence with the bat. That said, it's a shame England have failed to find a consistent test spinner since Swanny and Monty Panesar. I can name many who have been tried but either haven't been given a long enough run, had fitness issues, or were bang average at best for international standards: Moeen Ali, Adil Rashid, Dawson, Dom Bess, Jack Leach, Mason Crane, Shoaib Bashir (given Stokes's backing, he should slot right back in), Tom Hartley, Rehan Ahmed (but these days you'd find him opening the batting at Grace Road), etc.

The only long term option I see at the moment is Jacob Bethell, considering 35 isn't necessarily always a kind age to return to the fold in test cricket for Liam Dawson.

Moeen Ali was a batter who could bowl as he was coming through, he only really became a proper bowler once he started to play for England and he got a lot out of his talent as a bowler, to the detriment of his batting (him being shunted up and down the order didn't help neither!), so that wouldn't be the path I'd want Bethell to take, especially when Rehan Ahmed's younger brother Farhan is looking like such a hot talent

 

[Red_Ink_Squid]

Dawson to take over the bashir role

Hopefully in addition to this he will also bat and bowl.

 

[Ali TT]

The only long term option I see at the moment is Jacob Bethell, considering 35 isn't necessarily always a kind age to return to the fold in test cricket for Liam Dawson.

Seems to be going fine for Scott Boland

 

[jaydesh]

Seems to be going fine for Scott Boland

True. But Boland is kind of helped by the fact that up until the West Indies series that just completed, he has generally been sitting on the bench for a lot of the tests, with the exception of a few surfaces really conducive to his bowling style like the MCG, Sydney, etc.

 

[BigBeefy]

Crawley
Duckett
Pope
Root
Brook
Stokes
Smith
Woakes
Atkinson
Carse
Tongue

Expecting a pace attack here with the odd smattering of Joe Root to manage Stokes workload.

Think that lineup bats relatively long too which could be important.

Keep Jof fresh for The Oval.

 

[the big bambino]

True. But Boland is kind of helped by the fact that up until the West Indies series that just completed, he has generally been sitting on the bench for a lot of the tests, with the exception of a few surfaces really conducive to his bowling style like the MCG, Sydney, etc.

He's sitting on the benches because Cummins Haze Starc and Lyon are in front of him.

There's been discussion about Gillespie recently and why his career ended at such a young age. Contrast that with the age of Australia's fast bowlers now. Or even England's. India regularly fields a majority of pace men over 30. There was Boult, Southee and Wagner for NZ. Henry now. Broad and Anderson. I think I'm ditching any prejudices I used to have regarding the age of cricketers, especially fast bowlers. Just follow their form and if its good their age is an irrelevance.

 

[CricAddict]

Duckett
Bethell
Pope
Root
Brook
Stokes
Smith
Dawson
Woakes
Atkinson
Carse

It's h4x.

 

[Daemon]

Happy if Archer sits out for batting depth

 

[honestbharani]

Archer and Bumrah will both play. I guess they may play Atkinson for Carse to manage his workload as they would have an eye on the guys they wanna start with in the Ashes. And obviously Dawson should come in for Bashir.


For India, I kinda expect no changes. Maybe if Sai Suds shows them he can field at first slip, he will come in for Karun. And I dunno how is Akashdeep's fitness which may see us return to Prasidh. But otherwise, no changes. And England look far stronger as they have done all series, on paper.

 

[cnerd123]

If they rest Bumrah I hope they give Arshdeep a run. Prasidh is clearly not up to standard atm.

 

[LangleyburyCCPlayer]

Happy if Archer sits out for batting depth

While it would be funny, Archer missing out for batting depth is unnecessary, we’re likely going to have Carse at 10, plus Archer is capable with the bat anyway

 

[andruid]

Assuming the England top seven is unchanged (despite the obvious shortcomings) then a lower four of Woakes, Dawson, Atkinson and Carse does seem very deep!

I've no idea if Archer will play at Old Trafford, he said in an interview yesterday he bowled a few more overs than expected and he is being managed still, I assume in the same manner as Bumrah. That being said, if Wood is a potential option for the 5th Test, Archer may play and be rested for The Oval.

I guess there are worse problems to have for the selectors.

So, the dream of an Ashes pace battery of Wood, Stone and Potts is still a possibility?

 

[RightArmMystery]

You sure about that”definitely” not playing ?

I would be amazed if Jofra played. He said after the Lords test that his "overs are mapped out until December", which basically means he's going to be wrapped in cotton wool. He'll only play 1 more Test this series, and I don't think it'll be this one.

 

[honestbharani]

I would be amazed if Jofra played. He said after the Lords test that his "overs are mapped out until December", which basically means he's going to be wrapped in cotton wool. He'll only play 1 more Test this series, and I don't think it'll be this one.

Both Bumrah and Archer would both likely play only one of the 2 back to back tests. It will be interesting if the respective managements went the opposite ways in terms of choosing which one.

 

[GIMH]

Play Archer at Old Trafford. Reason: I’ve only ever seen him bowl a white ball in person so

 

[honestbharani]

Play Archer at Old Trafford. Reason: I’ve only ever seen him bowl a white ball in person so

Haha dont worry. I expect both Archer and Bumrah to play the OT game unless the weather forecast is really terrible.

 

[GIMH]

Forecast okay currently