Scyld Berry 30 greatest test fast bowlers

[subshakerz]

The first tip off is that he literally never makes any all time teams.

Hadlee made a few ATG XIs in the Lord Cricket exercise.

 

[Coronis]

Send him to India or Pakistan and he'd probably get declared a deity and have places of worship for him

iirc there’s a few for Tendulkar

 

[subshakerz]

You've also expressed similar sentiments and it made sense. Plus I've always had a gap between him and McGrath. I don't think they're equals as some do, never have.

How close is it between Hadlee and McGrath? Are they in the same tier?

 

[kyear2]

I've also discussed Hadlee with a couple of friends who were his contemporaries (won't name names but one was a Pakistani test cricketer and the other England A) and they each believed he was the best bowler of the era. Impossible to get away, hostility and Mcgrath like accuracy. I think he's underrated because he's from NZ and not as large as life as Imran or Botham or from the larger than life Windies team.

Both Gower and Crowe rated Marshall and Lillee easily over Hadlee as bowlers, so did Viv who didn't particularly Hadlee, Holding didn't either.

 

[subshakerz]

Both Gower and Crowe rated Marshall and Lillee easily over Hadlee as bowlers, so did Viv who didn't particularly Hadlee, Holding didn't either.

Which ex cricketers did you speak to on Hadlee?

 

[Johan]

Wouldn't answer that without their permissions, and haven't spoken to them recently.

^

 

[kyear2]

Which ex cricketers did you speak to on Hadlee?

All I will say is that they're test cricketers.

 

[honestbharani]

I don’t need to hear Ashwin after his retirement thanks.

Oh... but you will.

 

[sayon basak]

Give my current Ind team Hadlee alongside Bumrah and we'd win everything

Replacing Bumrah with Hadlee would be a net positive as well, dude could bowl full series while offering a similar merit.

 

[Starfighter]

Both Gower and Crowe rated Marshall and Lillee easily over Hadlee as bowlers, so did Viv who didn't particularly Hadlee, Holding didn't either.

Holding would just be salty that Hadlee is universally considered a better bowler than him.

 

[peterhrt]

In 2010 the book In A League Of Their Own featured 100 all-time world teams picked by ex-players plus one by umpire Dickie Bird. The various fast bowlers featured in the following number of teams:

54 - Lillee
35 - Marshall
27 - Wasim Akram
21 - Imran Khan
20 - Hadlee
18 - Botham
14 - Lindwall
13 - Miller
10 - Holding
9 - Trueman
8 - Kapil Dev, McGrath
7 - Hall
6 - Roberts
4 - Ambrose, Garner
3 - Davidson, Donald, Larwood, McKenzie
2 - Walsh
1 - Adcock, Flintoff, Shaun Pollock, Procter, Statham

Adcock picked himself.

Holding chose Hadlee, but only selected those he had played against and excluded West Indians. Otherwise he said there would be a lot of teammates and he would be accused of bias.

 

[Johan]

Adcock picked himself.

Legend.

 

[kyear2]

Holding would just be salty that Hadlee is universally considered a better bowler than him.

He wasn't though. Not in the 80's, they weren't rated that far apart.

Holding was right in the mix with Imran and Hadlee, Hadlee was likely ahead, but it wasn't tiers apart.

Holding was rated more highly than he's rated here today

 

[Johan]

Holding was rated more highly than he's rated here today

Legacies always get revised after career, to be fair.

 

[ankitj]

Hmm I have met two of them. How about you?

guys I think are better than him and played in last 40 years would be

Sachin
Hadlee
Kallis
Steyn
Ambrose
McGrath
Marshall
Imran
Viv
Warne
arguably, Smith

Only Imran is unequivocally better than Murali IMO from that group. In fact Imran is the only one I would put ahead of Murali myself.

 

[sayon basak]

iirc there’s a few for Tendulkar

Maradona as well.

 

[Starfighter]

He wasn't though. Not in the 80's, they weren't rated that far apart.

Holding was right in the mix with Imran and Hadlee, Hadlee was likely ahead, but it wasn't tiers apart.

Holding was rated more highly than he's rated here today

And the here today rating is actually the one I trust more, because it's less biased and more influenced by the actual currency of a bowler - getting wickets - and less about impressions. Impressions would lead one to rating Akram as being better than McGrath.

 

[kyear2]

Legacies always get revised after career, to be fair.

True, spread sheets comes into it as well.

 

[Johan]

Only Imran is unequivocally better than Murali IMO from that group. In fact Imran is the only one I would put ahead of Murali myself.

You have Murali a fair bit higher than I do, to be fair.

 

[Johan]

True, spread sheets comes into it as well.

Compton went from being rated as one of the absolute greatest to ever hold a bat, to a Mahela Jayawerdene level Batsman, Statsguru gen is definitely kinder to Holding than that.