Top 50 Greatest test batters

[Johan]

WSC carries this bum.

 

[subshakerz]

Keyword – at one point, at one point it looked like Kohli will be elite ATG in tests, he ended up as a Martin Crowe level batsman. So No, Ponting was a low 40s average bat until 2002, then averaged 70 for 5 years, then regressed to a 40 averaging bat for the remainder of his career, that 40 woild probably be 30 if he played in a spicier era.

At no point did Kohli get grouped with Lara Tendulkar. Folks talked about him potentially being there. Ponting effectively was grouped with them until his long decline.

 

[Johan]

At no point did Kohli get grouped with Lara Tendulkar. Folks talked about him potentially being there. Ponting effectively was grouped with them until his long decline.

because his career practically ran parallel to them and the aggregate, sadly reality hit when Hayden and Langer weren't there to smack away the new ball.

 

[subshakerz]

48 on roads is ok, 40 in England, Pakistan is worthless considering how flat the pitches were, no Imran and scorecard of 617-382/2. He has one good knock against Hadlee in NZ but generally hit or miss on spicier Kiwi wickets, averaging 40 in NZ outside the absolute road he played on, in 73-74.

It's mediocre.

Look at it from the big picture, series averaging over 40 away, in NZ it's 2/3, WI it's 2/2 including WSC, England it's 2/3, Pakistan 1/1. So basically in 12 away series he only averaged less than 40 in 2.

That includes averaging very well against Hadlee and the WI top pacers. It's a huge stretch to call that mediocre. It's just wrong.

 

[subshakerz]

because his career practically ran parallel to them and the aggregate, sadly reality hit when Hayden and Langer weren't there to smack away the new ball.

Exactly, it ran parallel and while Lara was in a purple patch in the 2000s, Ponting was still considered the best bat in the world.

 

[Johan]

Look at it from the big picture, series averaging over 40 away, in NZ it's 2/3, WI it's 2/2 including WSC, England it's 2/3, Pakistan 1/1. So basically in 12 away series he only averaged less than 40 in 2.

That includes averaging very well against Hadlee and the WI top pacers. It's a huge stretch to call that mediocre. It's just wrong.

In NZ, in 1973-74 he went super big on the first flattie and then failed on the spicier result producing wickets very badly, I'm mostly focused on test record and objectively by just tests his away record doesn't stack upto the likes of Gavaskar, Sutcliffe or Hammond whom he is often compared to, it arguably doesn't stack upto any of the top twenty by just test records.

The people I referenced who I feel like turn a blind eye to Chappell's away record won't consider World Series Cricket anyway, like I said, WSC carries this bum.

 

[Johan]

Exactly, it ran parallel and while Lara was in a purple patch in the 2000s, Ponting was still considered the best bat in the world.

again, Hype, Ponting pulled a Kohli and ended up two tiers below Lara and three below Sachin.

 

[DrWolverine]

Chappell is a great batsman but his lack of playing(that series in Pak barely counts) in Asia knocks him to Tier 3 in my opinion.

 

[Johan]

Sutcliffe is definitely better than Chappell

 

[subshakerz]

again, Hype, Ponting pulled a Kohli and ended up two tiers below Lara and three below Sachin.

It wasn't just hype. You could use that to dismiss all peer rating.

 

[subshakerz]

Chappell is a great batsman but his lack of playing(that series in Pak barely counts) in Asia knocks him to Tier 3 in my opinion.

Asia in his time wasn't seen as the end all be all. He succeeded against top pacers to a really impressive degree which to me matters more.

 

[Johan]

It wasn't just hype. You could use that to dismiss all peer rating.

Sure, but the peer rating fell off after Ponting's retirement.

 

[Johan]

Asia in his time wasn't seen as the end all be all. He succeeded against top pacers to a really impressive degree which to me matters more.

Disagree, Asia had it's challenges, Ask Desmond Haynes and Gordon Greenidge. for someone like Chappell who displayed a tangible issue with Derek Underwood type spinners, the Indian quaret would be challenging.

 

[subshakerz]

In NZ, in 1973-74 he went super big on the first flattie and then failed on the spicier result producing wickets very badly, I'm mostly focused on test record and objectively by just tests his away record doesn't stack upto the likes of Gavaskar, Sutcliffe or Hammond whom he is often compared to, it arguably doesn't stack upto any of the top twenty by just test records.

The people I referenced who I feel like turn a blind eye to Chappell's away record won't consider World Series Cricket anyway, like I said, WSC carries this bum.

Lol Gavaskar had a worse record in Eng and Aus and didn't succeed away against Hadlee Lillee or the top WI pacers. Pretty much against Imran.

You didn't even address my argument. 12 away series, did good to great in 10 of them. Nothing about that is mediocre.

 

[subshakerz]

Sure, but the peer rating fell off after Ponting's retirement.

Not so sure about that but like I said he is in that group of Sanga, Root, etc but achieved a higher peak than them all.

 

[ma1978]

	Playing well against Australia, especially in Australia, should basically be the benchmark achievement for any halfway decent test playing batsman. They've been consistently the best test playing country in history, and you can count on one hand the number of eras where they've ever been outside the top two or three sides in the world. Of course it's a huge thing if you suck against them because generally speaking, especially over a career the length of Root's, they are more likely to consistently challenge you than any other country. You poor people don't get it. If Australia is ranked two, the team is seen as weak and not up to standard. That's how it should be if you have decent standards. Three or lower and it's a national embarrassment. Again, as it should be. The WSC-era test side and that of the mid-80s (except of course for TOTAB) rightly had their citizenships revoked, only to be reinstated once they began performing after the 87 WC and 89 Ashes. If you're an Australian and you consistently played mediocre-to-**** against England over a career for as long as Root has against Australia, you'd be nothing more than an embarrassing footnote, a stubborn piece of old chewing gum to be scraped off the sole of the shoe of Australian cricket. agreed. Root is a mediocrity because of his inability to perform against Australia

 

[subshakerz]

Disagree, Asia had it's challenges, Ask Desmond Haynes and Gordon Greenidge. for someone like Chappell who displayed a tangible issue with Derek Underwood type spinners, the Indian quaret would be challenging.

Ok but this is the only really serious argument against his away record. Basically not playing in India.

 

[Johan]

Lol Gavaskar had a worse record in Eng and Aus and didn't succeed away against Hadlee or the WI pacers.

You didn't even address my argument. 12 away series, did good to great in 10 of them. Nothing about that is mediocre.

He makes up for that by scoring against Imran in Pakistan, though.

I just told you, he averaged 40 in NZ without the flat wicket in his first game, 40 in England, 48 in WI, never played on dustier Pakistan wickets, never played on spinny indian wickets, all by just tests

 

[Johan]

	agreed. Root is a mediocrity because of his inability to perform against Australia

Yeah, Ken Barrington >>>>>> Rahul Dravid, averages 64 against Australia while Dravid averages 38

 

[Johan]

Not so sure about that but like I said he is in that group of Sanga, Root, etc but achieved a higher peak than them all.

Higher ceiling, lower floor.