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Debate thread for 2024 ranking of bowlers poll

Line and Length

Line and Length

Cricketer Of The Year
CricAddict said:
I would accept this if Verity was the original vote for all the 11 voters like you did.. But just go back and check how many and who edited votes to Verity to get him ahead of Ashwin and you will know that it is not right.
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A serious claim. Please substantiate.
 
H

howitzer

State Vice-Captain
CricAddict said:

2024 Ranking of Bowlers Poll

The votes have been counted for positions 19-21. 53 - Davidson; 31 - S.Pollock; 21 - Verity; 20 - Ashwin; 14 - Walsh; 11 - Cummins; 8 - Laker; 6 - Grimmett; 3 - Adcock, Robers, Philander; 1 - Miller. While Davidon and Pollock have retained their spots from the 2022 poll, Verity has climbed...
www.cricketweb.net
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I can't be arsed to check whether everyone who voted for Ashwin then has posted votes that have rated him lower. Can you substantiate that?
 
S

subshakerz

International Coach
CricAddict said:
Because I don't see much difference between the achievements of the 3 of them. And I had no idea two more voters will be saying "this" or something.

And on your above points, I can continue arguing but don't want to do so. Not interested in internet wars. That's for trolls. Let us move on.
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You stand by this, that Ashwin is equal to Donald and Garner?

Line and Length said:
The joke started on the first day of voting when one voter put Ashwin ahead of every other bowler, past and present.

It continued when one voter, when voting for Ashwin the first time, put him ahead of players he had voted for earlier. The next few posts included two who cut and pasted this voter's post adding "Me too" (or words to that effect.
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Yes. This Ashwin agenda seems to be an attempt to distort an otherwise good list. Thankfully sanity has prevailed.
 
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CricAddict

CricAddict

Cricketer Of The Year
subshakerz said:
You stand by this, that Ashwin is equal to Donald and Garner?



Yes. This Ashwin agenda seems to be an attempt to distort an otherwise good list. Thankfully sanity has prevailed.
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There is no Ashwin agenda. He is a seriously good bowler who is under-rated by you lot. Yes, I stand by saying that Ashwin has an equal case to both of them.
 
S

subshakerz

International Coach
CricAddict said:
@subshakerz you voted Verity ahead of Cummins, Walsh and Laker. You stand by that? You speak a lot about sample size. When someone has just 3 wickets per test and a total of 144 wickets, how do you consider that a good sample size to vote him ahead of Cummins, Walsh and Laker who all have much more wickets than him?
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I was split between Verity and Laker honestly but someone mentioned Laker as being more pitch dependent.

Cummins is still a current bowler so I docked him. Verity a better rep than Walsh who is also below 4WPM.
 
S

subshakerz

International Coach
CricAddict said:
There is no Ashwin agenda. He is a seriously good bowler who is under-rated by you lot. Yes, I stand by saying that Ashwin has an equal case to both of them.
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Yeah that's lunacy as far as I am concerned, no offense. Ashwin doesn't belong in the conversation with proper worldclass ATG pacers. We need to pushback against this type of thinking.
 
centurymaker

centurymaker

Cricketer Of The Year
subshakerz said:
It's not absurd at all. He was in the top ten pacers list we did before and has super high peer rating.
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Am I supposed to blindly believe the opinion of a handful of stats nerds on CW over the widespread opinion of the cricketing community as well as my own on Wasim Akram?

If all former cricketers were to vote today, Wasim Akram would turn out to be in the top 3 fast bowlers of all time. He is at worst top 6 or top 7.

Here's cricinfo's all time xi-

The World XI: Jack Hobbs, Len Hutton, Don Bradman, Sachin Tendulkar, Viv Richards, Garry Sobers, Adam Gilchrist, Malcolm Marshall, Shane Warne, Wasim Akram, Dennis Lillee


Jury -The jury comprised one former captain from each of the top Test-playing teams - Ian Chappell, Clive Lloyd, Tony Greig, Duleep Mendis, Ali Bacher, Intikhab Alam, John Wright, Ajit Wadekar - and four cricket historians and writers.
 
S

subshakerz

International Coach
centurymaker said:
Am I supposed to blindly believe the opinion of a handful of stats nerds on CW over the widespread opinion of the cricketing community on Wasim Akram as well as my own?

If all former cricketers were to vote today, Wasim Akram would turn out to be in the top 3 fast bowlers of all time. He is at worst top 6 or top 7.

Here's cricinfo's all time xi-

The World XI: Jack Hobbs, Len Hutton, Don Bradman, Sachin Tendulkar, Viv Richards, Garry Sobers, Adam Gilchrist, Malcolm Marshall, Shane Warne, Wasim Akram, Dennis Lillee


Jury -The jury comprised one former captain from each of the top Test-playing teams - Ian Chappell, Clive Lloyd, Tony Greig, Duleep Mendis, Ali Bacher, Intikhab Alam, John Wright, Ajit Wadekar - and four cricket historians and writers.
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Ooh bro I took you the opposite way, arguing Akram was ranked too high. Sorry.
 
CricAddict

CricAddict

Cricketer Of The Year
subshakerz said:
Yeah that's lunacy as far as I am concerned, no offense. Ashwin doesn't belong in the conversation with proper worldclass ATG pacers. We need to pushback against this type of thinking.
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Type of bowling doesn't matter. Achievements matter more. I haven't seen Garner and so not much idea about him. But having seen a lot of Donald as well as Ashwin, I can fairly assume that they are both equally skilled.
 
CricAddict

CricAddict

Cricketer Of The Year
Socerer 01 said:
yeah look i like Ashwin and i like @CricAddict but idk how he’s better equal to Donald as a bowler

on the other hand if this is because subs thinks Ashwin is a club standard bowler then by all means i endorse this counter rating him high to make up for it :clap:
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Ha ha yes. Let me put it this way. Ashwin is as equal to Donald as Verity is better than Cummins, Laker, Walsh, Ashwin, Roberts or even Anderson.
 
S

subshakerz

International Coach
Socerer 01 said:
yeah look i like Ashwin and i like @CricAddict but idk how he’s better equal to Donald as a bowler

on the other hand if this is because subs thinks Ashwin is a club standard bowler then by all means i endorse this counter rating him high to make up for it :clap:
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The strategy didn't work though. They tried to prop Ashwin from the first vote but he is out of the top 20 because most of us aren't falling for that.
 
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