The best after the Don? CW ranked 25 contenders, here is the countdown thread

[weldone]

Fair enough. But that 100th hundred was a disgrace. Against Bangladesh in a losing cause. FMD.

fully agree - Tendulkar's only truly selfish knock

 

[srbhkshk]

Nah, its easy to say this in hindsight. He was batting all right in the 2011-12 overseas season. Looked good but kept finding weird ways to get out. In the home season ,yeah he was crap and should've retired.

Agree with this, it was a complex decision. I think that in his own mind he genuinely thought it was a form issue and not an age issue, and he can be sort of excused for that given how many times in his career he had come back after being in a poor patch. Calls of his retirement had been there since 2006ish. Even tried playing the Ranji to get it back, got that good hundred against Ishwar Pandey (whatever happended to that guy? ), but he was really done by that time, he just couldn't see it.

 

[Coronis]

Ridiculous that he's not top 3. Will be extremely disappointed if Viv isn't third.

 

[AndrewB]

I don't want to have a **** over his longevity but it really is remarkable how he managed to have basically two great batting careers in one,with two pretty different batting styles. Probably the best 18 year old batsman ever and also arguably the best 38 year old batsman ever.To do one of those is great , managing both is insane.

Hobbs had a similar sort of split in his pre-war and post-war careers, but with a smaller age gap - he was a great late-20s batsman and probably the best ever 40+ batsman.

 

[centurymaker]

Viv a better Test bat than Tendulkar? oh please. In ODIs maybe but definitely not in tests.

 

[mr_mister]

What I find weird is that people even value the hybrid 'international' stat. Like other then Tendulkars test and ODI centuries equalling 100, has anyone cared about the combined value of the two forms before or since?

 

[weldone]

Viv a better Test bat than Tendulkar? oh please. In ODIs maybe but definitely not in tests.

This is not a test only ranking.

 

[Coronis]

This is not a test only ranking.

No, its about first class. Again, Viv is not better than Sachin by any means other than "swagger".

 

[Bijed]

Really enjoying these write-ups. mr_mister deservedly raking in the likes from this thread.

 

[Kirkut]

Saaachin!!!! Not just a sporting hero but among the most influential personalities the country has ever produced!

He had an infectious aura which cannot be described in words, not that India never had an attacking batsman before - we did have Kapil, Srikkanth, Sidhu and Azhar, we also had stats giant in Gavaskar but none of these guys were as strongly influential as Sachin. In the 90s Lara had already made monster scores before he turned 30, Steve Waugh scored big against toughest attacks and in important games and Sachin at that time had no statistical achievements to his name, which goes on to show that his craze was beyond numbers.

 

[Slifer]

I also give him the benefit of not getting to play against the Indian bowling specifically in 90s (and generally all his career). Viv / Ponting didn't have to face the best attack of their times, Tendulkar on the other hand didn't get to face the worst.

No one knows how a player would do vs their own attack. India certainly didn't have the worst attack during Tendulkar s time, that would be one of Zimbabwe or Bangladesh, both of whom Tendulkar player extensively. Viv may never have faced his own attack but he also never faced any as poor as Zim/bang or WI post 2000 for that matter. I know u said the 90s, but Tendulkars career extended way past that time frame.

 

[Slifer]

For u Sachin fans losing your marbles because we had the temerity to rank Viv over him please calm down. You all talk about aura, influence bla bla. Well bk in 1970s England when us west Indians used to travel to England it was a very non pc atmosphere. Not to mention the whole grovel comment which came on the heels of the hiding in Australia. The media considered WI weak not to mention the literal signs all over England that made it feel like Jim crow in England. Against this back drop Viv goes to England in 76 and but for illness, would've broken Bradman record for most runs in a series. He faces Lillee and Co a few years later and murders them. Viv is probably overrated a tad but for my generation of West Indians he was and is a hero and icon.

 

[srbhkshk]

No one knows how a player would do vs their own attack. India certainly didn't have the worst attack during Tendulkar s time, that would be one of Zimbabwe or Bangladesh, both of whom Tendulkar player extensively. Viv may never have faced his own attack but he also never faced any as poor as Zim/bang or WI post 2000 for that matter. I know u said the 90s, but Tendulkars career extended way past that time frame.

I am really only talking about the top teams, and I don't really know why it's controversial to say that a batsman would do better against a poorer attack.

 

[weldone]

No, its about first class. Again, Viv is not better than Sachin by any means other than "swagger".

I thought it's about overall batting (including LO stuff). The original thread didn't mention anything about tests or FC. That's why I kept Viv so high.

 

[OverratedSanity]

No one knows how a player would do vs their own attack. India certainly didn't have the worst attack during Tendulkar s time, that would be one of Zimbabwe or Bangladesh, both of whom Tendulkar player extensively. Viv may never have faced his own attack but he also never faced any as poor as Zim/bang or WI post 2000 for that matter. I know u said the 90s, but Tendulkars career extended way past that time frame.

I dunno I reckon Sachin Dravid and Laxman might have enjoyed playing the likes of Ishant, Sreesanth and Ashish Nehra.

 

[Slifer]

I dunno I reckon Sachin Dravid and Laxman might have enjoyed playing the likes of Ishant, Sreesanth and Ashish Nehra.

But the likes of Dravid on Co got to play Bangladesh and Zimbabwe extensively. Imo, that fact alone makes up for the fact that Viv didn't play his own team.

Ftr I never said Viv was better than Sachin I just took exception with people who thought that it was out of the realm of possibilities that he would be rated higher. Viv is a personal hero of my generation of West Indians.

 

[fredfertang]

I never much cared for Viv for a variety of reasons, but no batsman in the world has ever come close to creating the same sense of forboding I used to feel when he swaggered out to bat against England, not Virat Kohli, not Steve Smith, not Ricky Ponting and not even Allan Border

 

[a massive zebra]

no batsman in the world has ever come close to creating the same sense of forboding I used to feel when he swaggered out to bat against England

Lucky you were not born 40-50 years earlier then!

 

[OverratedSanity]

But the likes of Dravid on Co got to play Bangladesh and Zimbabwe extensively. Imo, that fact alone makes up for the fact that Viv didn't play his own team.

Ftr I never said Viv was better than Sachin I just took exception with people who thought that it was out of the realm of possibilities that he would be rated higher. Viv is a personal hero of my generation of West Indians.

I was just talking about that point in isolation (ie) that playing Indian bowlers might not necessarily have helped their stats.

Got no problem with people rating Viv higher than Sachin. Hell, I did so myself in the voting here.

 

[fredfertang]

Lucky you were not born 40-50 years earlier then!

At least with him you could pray for rain