All Time South Africa XI game

[Prince EWS]

For quite some time I've felt Faulkner's batting to be a little under-rated and his bowling to be over-rated, by virtue of what his record looks like in a modern context compared with how it would have looked at the time. He was an all-time great batting allrounder but he probably shouldn't be a team's frontline spinner unless they're also playing four frontline quicks (and no, Kallis doesn't qualify). I definitely think that it'd be a mistake to make him the fourth bowler against a team like the Australian ATG XI, the English ATG XI or the West Indian ATG XI that have been selected through this process. Tayfield was vastly superior bowler historically.

 

[OverratedSanity]

Nourse
Tayfield

 

[StephenZA]

Nourse
Tayfield

 

[Flametree]

Nourse and Tayfield for me too

 

[kingkallis]

AB de Villiers
Hugh Tayfield

 

[Dendarii]

For quite some time I've felt Faulkner's batting to be a little under-rated and his bowling to be over-rated, by virtue of what his record looks like in a modern context compared with how it would have looked at the time. He was an all-time great batting allrounder but he probably shouldn't be a team's frontline spinner unless they're also playing four frontline quicks (and no, Kallis doesn't qualify). I definitely think that it'd be a mistake to make him the fourth bowler against a team like the Australian ATG XI, the English ATG XI or the West Indian ATG XI that have been selected through this process. Tayfield was vastly superior bowler historically.

Faulkner's place in a best South African XI makes for an interesting discussion. There's no doubt he's a South African ATG, but he's not one of their best-ever batsman, and as you say he's not their best spinner. Normally that wouldn't be a problem for an allrounder, but Kallis already being there makes Faulkner perhaps a bit surplus to requirements. So it becomes a question of whether you go with him for one of the two remaining batting spots or leave him out to accommodate both Nourse and De Villiers, which isn't an easy decision.

 

[StephenZA]

SA's perennial problem, how many quality allrounders can you fit into one team? For me it becomes a scenario of the best team for the best conditions... in this case I would choose Faulkner over Procter for any spinning pitches. But he is not directly into my first choice XI.

 

[harsh.ag]

Pick another batsman imo. No team needs five front-line bowlers unless Bradman's one of the batsmen. Esp when they already have Kallis.

 

[StephenZA]

Fun exercise... could I quickly put together a quality team of SA allrounders....

Goddard*
Barlow
Kallis
Sinclair
Dave Nourse
Rice
Bland+
Faulkner
Procter
McMillian
Pollock

Took some liberty with Bland, but using him as a wk... probably missing some.

 

[Dendarii]

Fun exercise... could I quickly put together a quality team of SA allrounders....

Goddard*
Barlow
Kallis
Sinclair
Dave Nourse
Rice
Bland+
Faulkner
Procter
McMillian
Pollock

Took some liberty with Bland, but using him as a wk... probably missing some.

I was actually thinking about just that. You've also got Klusener and Philander as possibilities. And what about Andrew Hall as keeper given that he did the duties once in an ODI?

 

[StephenZA]

I was actually thinking about just that. You've also got Klusener and Philander as possibilities. And what about Andrew Hall as keeper given that he did the duties once in an ODI?

Kuiper, Cronje... list feels endless, if not at least very long.

 

[Starfighter]

You're forgetting Gordon White and Tip Snooke too. And Charlie Llewellyn and Denys Morkel. Not to mention Clive van Ryneveld. Herbert Lance too.

 

[ankitj]

Nourse
Tayfield

This for me too

 

[SeamUp]

You're forgetting Gordon White and Tip Snooke too. And Charlie Llewellyn and Denys Morkel. Not to mention Clive van Ryneveld. Herbert Lance too.

Very interesting cricketer.

Some say the first non-white to play test cricket for SA.

Also I think only him, Procter and Rice have over 1000 FC wickets as South Africans.

Just like the ages where fast spin was the in-thing. We seem to have had a few like him , Sid Pegler , Bert Vogler etc

One of the Wisden Cricketer's of the year in 1911 (Only Reggie Schwartz and Bert Vogler received it before him as a Saffer)

 

[Dendarii]

Pick another batsman imo. No team needs five front-line bowlers unless Bradman's one of the batsmen. Esp when they already have Kallis.

Perhaps it comes down to whether you're picking an XI to play other teams or one which acknowledges the best eleven players. If it's to play other teams then Kallis probably renders Faulkner unnecessary, although there might still be a case to be made because he offers a bit of variety. If it's South Africa's best ever players then he's certainly a candidate, and it might come down to just what other criteria are being used for the composition of the team.

 

[AndrewB]

Very interesting cricketer.

Some say the first non-white to play test cricket for SA.

Also I think only him, Procter and Rice have over 1000 FC wickets as South Africans.

Rice hasn't (930). Donald has (1216). Llewellyn just made it (1013)

 

[Prince EWS]

Faulkner's place in a best South African XI makes for an interesting discussion. There's no doubt he's a South African ATG, but he's not one of their best-ever batsman, and as you say he's not their best spinner. Normally that wouldn't be a problem for an allrounder, but Kallis already being there makes Faulkner perhaps a bit surplus to requirements. So it becomes a question of whether you go with him for one of the two remaining batting spots or leave him out to accommodate both Nourse and De Villiers, which isn't an easy decision.

I had him at six until recently because I felt he was probably their fourth best ever middle order batsman regardless, and that his bowling would then become a really handy option in the team.

I'm much more conflicted now because I think de Villiers has now moved past him as a batsman, and maybe even Amla too. I basically have to ask myself whether I think it's close enough for his bowling to give him the edge, and my answer is pretty much just "I don't know". I definitely wouldn't shaft Tayfield because of this though, so I'm glad it looks like he will win a spot here.

 

[SeamUp]

Rice hasn't (930). Donald has (1216). Llewellyn just made it (1013)

Thanks. Was going off the top of my head. Was close.

 

[NUFAN]

South Africa XI
1 Barry Richards
2 Graeme Smith
3 Jacques Kallis
4 Graeme Pollock
5 Abraham de Villiers
6
7 John Waite+
8 Mike Procter
9 Hugh Tayfield
10 Dale Steyn
11 Allan Donald

 

[NUFAN]

- Select the South Africa number 6

- Select both South Africa A openers