ATG 'Mixed Nations' ODI XI - Draft

[Zinzan]

the precedent has already been set AndyZ. You can pick anyone from any team. 2 free choices essentially. Though I felt it would have been better to work your way back up the list eg the last picked team you were eligible to pick from, Zinzan went ahead and just chose from a random team when faced with a similar situation a few rounds ago


tbf to Zin, it was my fault for not stating any rules; i didn't know this was a possible outcome of locking countries. silly me

Yeah, I only picked an Eng player the 2nd time in the round because I was forced to. That should be the only exception.

 

[Zinzan]

Sorry chaps, I'm choosing Angelo Mathews instead of Malinga, as I'd somehow forgotten I'd already selected Gough.

1. Paul Stirling (As)
2. _
3. Brian Lara (WI)
4. Sachin Tendulkar (Ind)
5._
6. Angelo Mathews (SL)
7. Imran Khan (Pak)
8. Daniel Vettori (NZL)
9. Mashrafe Mortaza (Ban)
10. Dale Steyn (SA)
11. Darren Gough (Eng)

Still to pick;


Zim
Aus

 

[AndyZaltzHair]

Alec Stewart (England)

Andrew Symonds (Australia)

1. Saurav Ganguly [c]
2. Glenn Turner
3.
4.
5. Andrew Symonds
6. Alec Stewart [+]
7. Andy Blignaut
8. Wasim Akram
9. Mohammad Rafique
10. Hamid Hassan
11. Muttiah Muralitharan

 

[kingkallis]

Yeah, I only picked an Eng player the 2nd time in the round because I was forced to. That should be the only exception.

Can you please explain this?

 

[mr_mister]

I think round 5 is the round in question, and he picked a second Associate player because he forced to, not an Englishmen. I felt, retrospectively, he should have been forced to choose from the last team he was eligible to pick from before they too were made ineligible, to nullify the advantage he suddenly had by picking from any team he wanted even though he was picking near the bottom of the round.

 

[Zinzan]

Can you please explain this?

2nd post on page 9 explains it.

 

[Zinzan]

I think round 5 is the round in question, and he picked a second Associate player because he forced to, not an Englishmen. I felt, retrospectively, he should have been forced to choose from the last team he was eligible to pick from before they too were made ineligible, to nullify the advantage he suddenly had by picking from any team he wanted even though he was picking near the bottom of the round.

Tbf, you'd already created a big advantage for those starting early by doing away with the normal & relatively fair alternating-random-reverse orders and instead using a revolving order that only advantages those going early in the first round. So hardly a big advantage from that for me, I had no choice.

 

[mr_mister]

yeah well, im a total noob at drafts and red hill suggested it. I assumed by his post count he knew what he was talking about.

besides someone was always going to have to go first in the first round

 

[Zinzan]

yeah well, im a total noob at drafts and red hill suggested it. I assumed by his post count he knew what he was talking about.

It's no big deal tbh, just seemed ironic you suggesting that somehow gave me an advantage when I was one of the last in the first round. I had to choose on one of the teams.

besides someone was always going to have to go first in the first round

The difference is the normal system reverses every alternative round so going 1st also means going last the next round, & then it's random again.

In this system, going first means going 2nd, 3rd etc, giving that person early picks every time at the stage the best players are available.

 

[mr_mister]

it does give you advantage though I think. You have every country unlocked for you, when a major point in choosing last in a round is to have a small number of available countries.

 

[Zinzan]

it does give you advantage though I think. You have every country unlocked for you, when a major point in choosing last in a round is to have a small number of available countries.

Nah, that doesn't make sense. You're referring to one occasion in which I couldn't pick another English player, so got the choice between a few other sides as opposed to someone who started the draft 1st in round 1, 2nd in round two, 3rd in round 3 etc. Kind of obvious which one is more advantaged.

 

[Red]

I'll take John Davison from Canada, explosive big hitting bat, handy spinner.

Red Hill CC

Virender Sehwag (Ind)
Adam Gilchrist + (Aus)
Tillekaratne Dilshan (SL)
Javed Miandad (Pak)
~
Ian Botham (Eng) (3)
John Davison (5)
Sean Ervine (Zim) (5)
Richard Hadlee (NZ) (2)
~
Curtly Ambrose (WI) (1)


Still to pick from: Bangladesh | SA

 

[Red]

Tbf, you'd already created a big advantage for those starting early by doing away with the normal & relatively fair alternating-random-reverse orders and instead using a revolving order that only advantages those going early in the first round. So hardly a big advantage from that for me, I had no choice.

My thought was that the revolving order would work well because of the nature of this draft. And I think it has. If you look at your first three selections (sitting mid table) you've taken Tendulkar, Imran and Lara. The actual first selections in each round were Shakib, Mushfiqur and Warne. So while the earlier selection in each round have been able to get the cream of the lesser teams, you've been able to just get better players overall. Perhaps it's harder later when you have to pick your associates and Bangladeshis from a reduced pool, but you should already have a very impressive spine if you drafted well (which you have).

 

[NZTailender]

My thought was that the revolving order would work well because of the nature of this draft. And I think it has. If you look at your first three selections (sitting mid table) you've taken Tendulkar, Imran and Lara. The actual first selections in each round were Shakib, Mushfiqur and Warne. So while the earlier selection in each round have been able to get the cream of the lesser teams, you've been able to just get better players overall. Perhaps it's harder later when you have to pick your associates and Bangladeshis from a reduced pool, but you should already have a very impressive spine if you drafted well (which you have).

Yeah in hindsight my decision to pick from the minnows in the first few rounds has backfired as I've not got many guns to choose from in the remaining teams (Eng, Sri and WI).

 

[mr_mister]

Nah, that doesn't make sense. You're referring to one occasion in which I couldn't pick another English player, so got the choice between a few other sides as opposed to someone who started the draft 1st in round 1, 2nd in round two, 3rd in round 3 etc. Kind of obvious which one is more advantaged.

it does make sense you're just twisting my words now. nowhere did i defend the revolving system. but the way you went and chose a random country did give you an advantage, in that particular area, just like AndyZ technically received an advantage by also being able to pick a random country. It's not rocket science. I have no idea how much it advantaged you and I never said it advantaged you as much as someone who had first pick round 1. But it did advantage you over someone who was forced to pick from 1 or 2 countries and went before you in the round. Because you got a wider pool of players to pick from when you were meant to get less.

anyway im going to drop it because it really doesnt matter that much, it's just that AndyZ asked

 

[NZTailender]

Round 1

NZTailender - Shakib Al-Hasan
Coronis - Ryan ten Doeschate
Walkingwicket - Andy Flower
AndyZaltHair - Wasim Akram
morgieb - Andrew Flintoff
schearzie - Kumar Sangakkara
Zinzan - Sachin Tendulkar
Red Hill - Richard Hadlee
King Kallis - Viv Richards
mr_mister - Hashim Amla
Overrated Sanity - Glenn McGrath

Round 2

Overrated Sanity - Mushfiqur Rahim
NZTailender - AB De Villiers
Coronis - Heath Streak
Walkingwicket - Joel Garner
AndyZaltHair - Muttiah Muralitharan
morgieb - Steve Tikolo
schearzie - Kevin Pieterson
Zinzan - Imran Khan
Red Hill - Adam Gilchrist
King Kallis - MS Dhoni
mr_mister - Shane Bond

Round 3

mr_mister - Shane Warne
Overrated Sanity - Virat Kohli
NZTailender - Brendan Taylor
Coronis - Sanath Jayasuria
Walkingwicket - Shaun Pollock
AndyZaltHair - Hamid Hassan
morgieb- Saqlain Mushtaq
schearzie- Mohammad Mahmudullah
Zinzan- Brian Lara
Red Hill- Ian Botham
King Kallis- Chris Cairns

Round 4

King Kallis- Allan Donald
mr_mister- Tamim Iqbal
Overrated Sanity- Gordon Greenidge
NZTailender- Waqar Younis
Coronis- Kane Williamson
Walkingwicket- Ricky Ponting
AndyZaltHair- Saurav Ganguly
morgieb- Chaminda Vaas
schearzie- Kevin O'Brien
Zinzan - Darren Gough
Red Hill - Sean Ervine

Round 5

Red Hill- Virender Sehwag
King Kallis- Abdur Razzak
mr_mister- Grant Flower
Overrated Sanity- Lance Klusener
NZTailender- Thomas Odoyo
Coronis- Micheal Holding
Walkingwicket- Mahela Jayawardene
AndyZaltHair- Glenn Turner
morgieb- Micheal Bevan
schearzie- Zaheer Abbas
Zinzan- Paul Stirling

Round 6

Zinzan- Daniel Vettori
Red Hill- Curtley Ambrose
King Kallis- Saeed Anwar
mr_mister- Niall O'Brien
Overrated Sanity- Aravinda De Silva
NZTailender- Bret Lee
Coronis- Jaques Kallis
Walkingwicket- Mustafizur Rahman
AndyZaltHair- Andy Blignaut
morgieb- Rahul Dravid
schearzie- Kapil Dev

Round 7

schearzie- Dennis Lillee
Zinzan- Dale Steyn
Red Hill- Tilakaratne Dilshan
King Kallis- Paul Collingwood
mr_mister- Malcolm Marshall
Overrated Sanity- Trent Boult
NZTailender- Yuvraj Singh
Coronis- Salman Butt
Walkingwicket- William Porterfield
AndyZaltHair- Mo Rafique
morgieb- Neil Johnson

Round 8

morgieb- Morne Morkel
schearzie- Andy Roberts
Zinzan- Mashrafe Mortaza
Red Hill- Javed Miandad
King Kallis- Eddo Brandes
mr_mister- Arjuna Ranatunga
Overrated Sanity- Marcus Trescothick
NZTailender- Nathan Astle
Coronis- Brad Hogg
Walkingwicket- Anil Kumble
AndyZaltHair- Alec Stewart

Round 9

AndyZaltHair- Andrew Symonds
morgieb- Chris Gayle
schearzie- Jonty Rhodes
Zinzan- Angelo Mathews
Red Hill- John Davison
King Kallis-
mr_mister-
Overrated Sanity-
NZTailender-
Coronis-
Walkingwicket-

Round 10

Walkingwicket-
AndyZaltHair-
morgieb-
schearzie-
Zinzan-
Red Hill-
King Kallis-
mr_mister-
Overrated Sanity-
NZTailender-
Coronis-

Round 11

Coronis-
Walkingwicket-
AndyZaltHair-
morgieb-
schearzie-
Zinzan-
Red Hill-
King Kallis-
mr_mister-
Overrated Sanity-
NZTailender-

 

[NZTailender]

King Kallis->mr_mister- >Overrated Sanity

Teams remaining this round:

Pakistan
India
Bangladesh
New Zealand
England
Zimbabwe

 

[Zinzan]

it does make sense you're just twisting my words now. nowhere did i defend the revolving system. but the way you went and chose a random country did give you an advantage, in that particular area, just like AndyZ technically received an advantage by also being able to pick a random country. It's not rocket science. Did it advantage you and Andy as much as the person who picked first and second round 1? no. what about who picked third? probably not. fourth? maybe? etc etc It doesn't really matter as I don't see it as relevent to the point I was making.

anyway im going to drop it because it really doesnt matter that much, it's just that AndyZ asked

It's cool, and as I said it's really not a big deal, it is after all just a bit of fun. I only responded because it was ironic you make the point about Andy & I being advantaged when the 'real' advantage is with those who were lucky enough to get a good pole position in the first round. So kind of a case of pointing out the lesser of two evils here.

Anyway, at least we've learned for future reference that the alternating-random/reversing system is the fairest way to go, & not a system that allows someone to be lucky enough to be 1st, 2nd, 3rd etc in the first 3 rounds....and on top of that one that doesn't even achieve what was intended to start with.

 

[mr_mister]

i agree.

 

[kingkallis]

Everything went over my head.

mr_mister, tell me from which countries can I pick now?