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Thread: *Official* India in Bangladesh 2015

  1. #16
    Cricket Web: All-Time Legend zorax's Avatar
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    Harby's good spells in those tours came when he started tossing it up.

    He just couldn't do that consistently, for whatever reason. He was bowling flat, he was bowling ineffectively, and occasionally would bowl well.

    You could make a case for him being told to be flat and defensive due to the pitches. However, I think he just didn't have the rhythm or confidence to toss it up regularly. Ashwin came in and bowled slowly and spun it hard on those same dead tracks and reaped the rewards. Ojha bowled slowly and was effective.

    Bowling quick isn't even the main issue. He just wasn't effective. Jadeja came in and bowled darts, but spun them harder and got turn and bounce.

    My abiding memory of Harbhajan was just flat, wicket-to-wicket topspinners with the odd doosra thrown in here and then. He just wasn't effective. He's always been at his best when he bowled slower and tried attacking outside of off. For whatever reason he wasn't doing that. Given how Ashwin came in and did that so well, I doubt it was MSD's orders.

    During this phase he was also pretty good in Limited Overs cricket and I thought he shouldn't have been dropped from the ODI/T20 sides, but Ashwin's emergence as a wicket-taker in both formats basically made his position in the side untenable. Jadeja and Ashwin made for a good ODI pair and so Harbhajan had to go.

  2. #17
    Cricket Web: All-Time Legend Shri's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Contra View Post
    The context in which he was picked was hardly ideal tbh, "Oh look, England can't play spin, lets throw Bhajji in there too for lolz", " oh Harby always does well against Aus, lets give him a go, Aussies suck anyways lol". Can't just pick and drop at random, Harbhajan has always been a confidence bowler anyways, not the guy who will bowl well if he feels he's gonna get the boot the next test.

    My point is that the kind of pitches India has produced since 2011 WI series have been largely TYPICAL Indian wickets that aid spin, which is different from that lame 07-10 period where India produced at least 1 or 2 highway wickets everytime someone toured, giving overseas teams a false sense of security of being able to play spin on the SC, and then those same teams had a cry when they came across pitches that actually turned.

    You can't honestly tell me that Harby wouldn't have taken a bagful against Windies (5 tests since 2011) and done reasonably well against Aus/NZ/England if given a proper go. I'm not trying to suggest that he's better than Ashwin/other spinners that have played in the last few years, but Harby's "decline" is as much to do with the kind of pitches he played on as the lack of flight and "dart" bowling that everyone uses criticize.

    Lets also not forget that Harby had successful tours to NZ and SA during India's #1 period.
    Lets see where you hide when he starts darting them down the leg side on a rank turner yet again. **** Bhajji.
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  3. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by Contra View Post
    Lets also not forget that Harby had successful tours to NZ and SA during India's #1 period.
    Yeah, this isn't mentioned anywhere near as mucha s it should. Would've won us the SA series if Dhoni wasn't a complete idiot.
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  4. #19
    International Coach weldone's Avatar
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    I think Ganguly being appointed as BCCI advisor may have something to do with the Harby return. It is actually a good move given he's probably still better than all spinners apart from Ashwin, but only if he can control his ego and get used to the role of 2nd spinner when required (and reserve spinner otherwise).
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  5. #20
    Cricketer Of The Year AndyZaltzHair's Avatar
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    Didnt Ganguly get the appointment after the announcement of squad?
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  6. #21
    Cricketer Of The Year AndyZaltzHair's Avatar
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    I am a bit confused about the advisor's role tbh. Ganguly, Tendulkar and Laxman are appointed if I'm not wrong. Don't know how these things work but are so many advisors required? It's a good thing that guys like Tendulkar, Ganguly and Laxman are involved in BCCI though.

  7. #22
    International Coach weldone's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by AndyZaltzHair View Post
    Didnt Ganguly get the appointment after the announcement of squad?
    He was already advising BCCI under some capacity...the official announcement came later

  8. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by AndyZaltzHair View Post
    I am a bit confused about the advisor's role tbh. Ganguly, Tendulkar and Laxman are appointed if I'm not wrong. Don't know how these things work but are so many advisors required? It's a good thing that guys like Tendulkar, Ganguly and Laxman are involved in BCCI though.
    If the rumours are to be believed, Ganguly is pushing for the job of coach. He has openly said that's his dream job. Depending on Tendulkar and Laxman's backing (Kohli and Dhoni's opinions will also count of course), he may get that in near future. It is important to note that we don't yet have a coach (contrary to what OP is saying). Shastri has been retained as the 'Team Director' for the BD tour. And that decision has been taken very late. We've had a long IPL, and yet BCCI couldn't decide on a coach. It is because there are too many big names who are interested in that job.

  9. #24
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    Quote Originally Posted by AndyZaltzHair View Post
    I am a bit confused about the advisor's role tbh. Ganguly, Tendulkar and Laxman are appointed if I'm not wrong. Don't know how these things work but are so many advisors required? It's a good thing that guys like Tendulkar, Ganguly and Laxman are involved in BCCI though.
    They approached Dravid as well but he declined sadly.

  10. #25
    Cricket Web: All-Time Legend zorax's Avatar
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    Dravid's gonna coach the U-19s tho?

  11. #26
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    Dravid will coach his son Lokesh.

  12. #27
    Cricketer Of The Year AndyZaltzHair's Avatar
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    Mullah hurt his fingers while practicing today. Out of the series now. Just scored a hundred in BCL. What a blow.

  13. #28
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    Hope they pick liton in riyad's place.

  14. #29
    Cricketer Of The Year Contra's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by zorax View Post
    Harby's good spells in those tours came when he started tossing it up.

    He just couldn't do that consistently, for whatever reason. He was bowling flat, he was bowling ineffectively, and occasionally would bowl well.

    You could make a case for him being told to be flat and defensive due to the pitches. However, I think he just didn't have the rhythm or confidence to toss it up regularly. Ashwin came in and bowled slowly and spun it hard on those same dead tracks and reaped the rewards. Ojha bowled slowly and was effective.

    Bowling quick isn't even the main issue. He just wasn't effective. Jadeja came in and bowled darts, but spun them harder and got turn and bounce.

    My abiding memory of Harbhajan was just flat, wicket-to-wicket topspinners with the odd doosra thrown in here and then. He just wasn't effective. He's always been at his best when he bowled slower and tried attacking outside of off. For whatever reason he wasn't doing that. Given how Ashwin came in and did that so well, I doubt it was MSD's orders.

    During this phase he was also pretty good in Limited Overs cricket and I thought he shouldn't have been dropped from the ODI/T20 sides, but Ashwin's emergence as a wicket-taker in both formats basically made his position in the side untenable. Jadeja and Ashwin made for a good ODI pair and so Harbhajan had to go.
    Nope, as far as I'm concerned the pitches produced by India during the 07-10 period were considerably flatter than those from 2011 onwards. I don't deny that spinners other than Harbhajan should have got a chance to play at the time when he was dropped, but that doesn't automatically mean he was awful outright. I remember NZ drawing the first 2 tests back in 2010 on absolute joke pitches and then the last one actually turned a bit and we beat NZ in the 3rd test. Then there was that SL tour when Harby bowled on SSC where it was yet another 600 v 600 contest and then had to skip the next test (can't remember the reason) which was spin friendly. It's little things like that that eventually add up and give the impression that Harby wasn't doing well.

    All I'm saying is that he deserves his call back because I don't think I've seen him have even one bad IPL season in all these years, and Harby is not the guy you can ask to go to Ranji trophy and take bucketloads of wickets, he needs the big stage to get that extra kick and I feel as though he's good enough to bowl India to victories even now. I think its fair game between Harby/Ashwin and other spinners to be picked for tests depending on the balance of the side. Personally, I'd still play Ashwin/Jadeja at home due to the balance of the side, but I wouldn't be against Harby playing.

  15. #30
    Request Your Custom Title Now! OverratedSanity's Avatar
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    Harby bowled rubbish vs England on a Mumbai pitch where Suresh Raina could've spun it square.
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