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Greatest test opener?

Adamc

Cricketer Of The Year
Prince EWS said:
know I will get blasted for this but I dont believe Hayden is an opener, nor a lot of other "openers" currently playing.

The best quality in an opener is too ALWAYS get a start. You dont even really need many runs. Just always face a decent number of balls. Hayden and Langer are too agrressive for mine to be openers, despite their success.

So in my way of thinking, Richardson is far and away the best opener currently, especially since their arent many around. Chopra, Gripper etc seem to at least have the right idea, but they fail as often as the aggressive openers. :sigh:
It seems that the modern trend amongst some openers is not to see off the new ball but to beat the life out of it. This is usually a successful method because flat pitches don't offer new ball bowlers any great advantage. The likes of Richardson would probably have more success than the likes of Hayden on seaming pitches which offer obvious advantages to new ball bowlers, but unfortunately such pitches are far too uncommon, so it is likely that the trend towards aggressive openers will continue.
 

NZTailender

I can't believe I ate the whole thing
NZTailender said:
and i spose Graeme Smith goes out there and makes cups of tea?

and hes what...23?


games: 21
innings: 34
not out: 2
runs: 1881
high score: 277
average: 58.78
strike rate: 65.63
hundreds: 6
fiftys: 4

http://statserver.cricket.org/perl/...=0&stumpedlow=&stumpedhigh=&csearch=&submit=1

theres a few low scores there..but id say he'll probably be one of the worlds best, in history of the game, in the future.
LOL. man i need to lay off the drink. i completely misread your post, PY. i thoguht you said 'i thought hayden was the only true opener' or the like. i need to get some sleep. :lol:
 

PY

International Coach
NZTailender said:
LOL. man i need to lay off the drink. i completely misread your post, PY. i thoguht you said 'i thought hayden was the only true opener' or the like. i need to get some sleep. :lol:
:lol:

If I ever heard me saying that, I'd have to kick my own ass. :D

It doesn't even mention Hayden. :lol:
 

NZTailender

I can't believe I ate the whole thing
LOL. im used to other forums including the quotes if theyve quoted someone. didnt do it there. :!(


Originally posted by Prince EWS
know I will get blasted for this but I dont believe Hayden is an opener, nor a lot of other "openers" currently playing.

The best quality in an opener is too ALWAYS get a start. You dont even really need many runs. Just always face a decent number of balls. Hayden and Langer are too agrressive for mine to be openers, despite their success.

So in my way of thinking, Richardson is far and away the best opener currently, especially since their arent many around. Chopra, Gripper etc seem to at least have the right idea, but they fail as often as the aggressive openers. :sigh:




;)
 

PY

International Coach
Prince EWS said:
know I will get blasted for this but I dont believe Hayden is an opener, nor a lot of other "openers" currently playing.

The best quality in an opener is too ALWAYS get a start. You dont even really need many runs. Just always face a decent number of balls. Hayden and Langer are too agrressive for mine to be openers, despite their success.

So in my way of thinking, Richardson is far and away the best opener currently, especially since their arent many around. Chopra, Gripper etc seem to at least have the right idea, but they fail as often as the aggressive openers. :sigh:
Good ol' Geoff Boycott has to rate fairly highly on all-time list if it was done by this school of thought.

I agree pretty much agree with this, Hayden et al don't bat any differently when opening as they would if they were down at 4/5/6 etc. Openers' job is to see off the new ball.

The aggressive opener will get the shine off a lot quicker than a studious opener but there's always the chance that due to the new ball the aggressive approach will just cause them to hack at a decent ball and get out.

However you can't argue with their records. So basically I'm waffling. :D
 

marc71178

Eyes not spreadsheets
FRAZ said:
NOW: Taufeeq Umar and Tendulkar
All times : Saeed Anwar and Sunil Gawaskar
Beat that !!!!
First pairing is easily beaten as one isn't an opener.

As a pairing there's Langer & Hayden or Smith & Gibbs are both successful.

All time - Hobbs and Sutcliffe take some beating!!!
 

marc71178

Eyes not spreadsheets
TDCC Young Guns said:
also richardson does it in nz, which is arguablly the hardest place in the world to face the new ball.
The West Indies in the 80s were probably a fair bit trickier...
 

Neil Pickup

Cricket Web Moderator
Currently, I would choose Hayden and Richardson as my opening partnership with Gibbs and Vaughan third and fourth choices.

I still don't rate Graeme Smith because of the clear technical flaws he has outside off stump. If there are green seamers in NZ, I reckon if Tuffey gets it up there outside off moving away, then he'll have him for breakfast.
 

Richard

Cricket Web Staff Member
Best of all-time it's hard to look past Sir John Berry Hobbs. Herbert Sutcliffe, Sir Leonard Hutton , WG Grace, Bill Woodfull and Gavaskar all deserve a mention.
Best ATM I'd say Richardson is a vastly overrated flat-track bully (contrary to seemingly-logical assumptions based on generalisations, the wickets he has played mostly on have offered very little to the seamers), England and Caddick esp. completely exposed his vulnerability against the ball coming back into him from outside off and I hope they might do the same soon again. Everyone knows my views on Hayden and there's no point repeating them. Herschelle Gibbs is now slightly overrated and flattered by his average and Vaughan, thanks to just 4 innings in which he had early let-offs, somehow gets in there in many's estimation. Sehwag was very, very fortunate to get as many runs as he did in Australia and no way is he yet established as a Test-class opener.
Graeme Smith for me has the most ability and ATM has a fantastic record. We'll see if he ever has to bat on a green seamer how he fares then. I find it hard to look past him but I feel Taufeeq Umar could well be a potential rival. A very, very solid player with an excellent record, especially for a Pakistani. The new Saeed Anwar? Maybe not in style but in substance, definately. Possibly even a bit better as far as Test-matches are concerned.
I also feel Atapattu has ability of extraordinary proportions but there's simply no disputing his inconsistency.
 

Anil

Hall of Fame Member
The greatest test opener I have seen: Gavaskar. He is defintely up there as one of the greatest of all time if not the greatest.
 

Pratters

Cricket, Lovely Cricket
I would say Boycott should deserve a mention as among the best of all time. He lost about 2-3 years of cricket due to injury/suspension and else I am sure he would have scored more than 10,000 runs and people would have recognised him more for his achievments.
 

Tom Halsey

International Coach
Yes, but he wasn't a very nice person. Once, behind his back, the England team asked Botham, when he was batting with him, to accidentally-on-purpose run him out.
 

iamdavid

International Debutant
Hmm , for me the best opener of all time was Herb Sutcliffe , Hutton , Hobbs , Gavaskar , Boycott , Brown , Morris , Greenidge , Haynes , Woodful all not far behind.

From todays batch I reckon Gary Kirsten , except he dosent open any more.
All the other contenders have great records yet dont quite come up to the mark of Kirsten IMO.
Smith - Technically flawed outside his off stump , yet to play against good bowling or in trying conditions.
Hayden - Can be a little over attacking to the point of arrogance , there is still a question mark over his ability when the ball is swinging through the air.
Vaughan - Technically almost perfect & a great temperament , but his patience has been tested lately.
Gibbs - The technique has improved out of sight since his test debut , but he still has problems with his feet being glued to the crease when the ball moves late.
Lacks patience.
Atapattu - Technically perfect , flawless game against both the spinners & quick bowlers , a decent range of shots which are superb to watch , the patience to bat for long periods against the best bowlers.
Only problem is that he's a very nervous starter , and while the footwork is superb when he gets set , its often pretty ordinary early on.
Thus why he averages around 40 rather than 50.
Richardson - Technically very sound , apart from the gate he leaves when he tries to drive at balls from over the wicket , Ive seen him get bowled like that a few to many times for my likeing , its almost as though he's trying to get outside the line of the ball rather than hit straight through it.
He's the most patient batsman in the world though.
Sehwag - Has the most prodigious hand/eye coordination & can hit the ball a mile , but he still has the back foot flaw (McGrath just wasnt there to expose it this summer :( ) & basically no foot movement at all.
He's been bloody lucky for a major part of his carear & he lacks the patience to do well against the best bowlers.
Gayle - Again superb hand/eye coordination & great wrists , allow him to hit the ball very hard , he dosent have the obvious flaws of Sehwag & he is slightly more patient.
But still the footwork is hardly text book & it gets him into trouble sometimes.
Umar - Great temperament , great wrists & a wide range of shots when he wants to use them.
MASSIVE POTENTIAL , just one thing holding him back , the way he premeditates onto the front foot , Ive seen him do it alot & the commentators pick it up , he goes forward almost before the bowler releases & he can sky his backfoot shots as a result.
He gets away with it on the subcontinent & its easily fixed so shouldnt affect him provided he addresses it soon.


Hmm , ATM I'd pick Hayden & Atapattu as my opening combo.
But Id replace Hayden with Kirsten if he was still opening.
 
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BlackCap_Fan

State Vice-Captain
Neil Pickup said:
Richardson a flat track bully and Smith the best? Riiight...
yeah,there couldnt possibly be any biasism(is that even a word?) in Richard' statement.

It takes some skill to have an average of 49.02 for over 10 innings on the worst batting pitches in the world.

Want an example? see India's last tour of New Zealand.The pitches then were a batsmens nightmare and a bowlers dream.

Although a strike rate of 38 says alot.

But,he has 17 50s in 28 innings,so he gets a good start most of the time,if not all the time.He has alot of pressure to really stay at the crease nad get some runs because of the inexpeience of the NZ side atm.

But now,he may have found a reasonable partner in Lou Vincent.But hes nothing in the league of Richardson.
 
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