View Poll Results: Greatest Match-Winner in the Australian Team of the 1990s-2000s?

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  • Glenn McGrath

    26 65.00%
  • Shane Warne

    9 22.50%
  • Ricky Ponting

    2 5.00%
  • Adam Gilchrist

    2 5.00%
  • Other

    1 2.50%
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Thread: Who was the biggest match-winner in the great Australian side?

  1. #61
    Cricket Web: All-Time Legend smalishah84's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ikki View Post
    Yeah, I know, I just couldn't be arsed writing avg. and sr. all the time.

    I agree with you in general though. I was just pointing it out because I remember I started a Donald thread, asking why he was so underrated, and people routinely said someone like McGrath just had a more complete record when you see that they're basically similar. Everyone bar Marshall, as far as I know, has a crap record here or there.
    Even Marshall averages 30+ in NZ IIRC. If you dissect a record so much, you are bound to come up with something
    And smalishah's avatar is the most classy one by far Jan certainly echoes the sentiments of CW

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  2. #62
    International Captain Migara's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ikki View Post
    Look at his record in Australia vs the various countries. Against S.Africa and NZ in Australia his record isn't good: 31 @ 80 and 33 @ 73 respectively. Very consistent, but as I've brought up in other threads it's about as consistent as many of the greats (i.e. Donald) were.
    Warne at home, 63 vs IND, 32 vs SL if nit picking is the name of the game.
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  3. #63
    International Coach Ikki's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by smalishah84 View Post
    Even Marshall averages 30+ in NZ IIRC. If you dissect a record so much, you are bound to come up with something
    True, but I'd still probably regard his record as the most complete if you're simply looking at home and away with good averages and strike rates. Imran is close too.

    Anyway, whether a player's record is perfectly complete doesn't discount him from being a big match-winner IMO. I was simply showing that McGrath is not perfect himself.
    Last edited by Ikki; 11-09-2013 at 08:43 AM.
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  4. #64
    International Regular Monk's Avatar
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    It's funny when we talk about averaging 30 as a bowler as a negative. It's about neutral imo


  5. #65
    International Coach Ikki's Avatar
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    It's not that he only averaged 30+ but that he struck very poorly (70s and 80s IIRC).

  6. #66
    International Regular kyear2's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ikki View Post
    Yeah, I know, I just couldn't be arsed writing avg. and sr. all the time.

    I agree with you in general though. I was just pointing it out because I remember I started a Donald thread, asking why he was so underrated, and people routinely said someone like McGrath just had a more complete record when you see that they're basically similar. Everyone bar Marshall, as far as I know, has a crap record here or there.
    Very true, nice to know you are coming around slightly, though I know it wouldn't elevate him in your overall ratings.

    Quote Originally Posted by smalishah84 View Post
    Even Marshall averages 30+ in NZ IIRC. If you dissect a record so much, you are bound to come up with something
    3 matches.


    Back on topic, McGrath definately for me with Ponting right behind, after that Warne and Gilchrist in no particular order. Your key players are generally your opening bowler and you dominant batsman (normally #3, sometimes #4) and McGrath generally took on and out the top guns/order from the opposition and generally set up Warne to finish off proceedings. Ponting on the other hand was often sheltered by Hayden and Langer above and buffered below by Gilchrist ect below. That tips it for McGrath for me over Ponting.
    1st XI
    Hutton | Hobbs | Bradman* | Richards^ | Tendulkar | Sobers5^ | Gilchrist+ | Khan3 | Marshall1 | Warne4^ | McGrath2
    2nd XI
    Sutcliffe | Gavaskar* | Headley | Chappell^ | Lara^ | Kallis5^ | Knott+ | Hadlee3 | Ambrose2 | Lillee1 | Muralitharan4
    3rd XI
    Greenidge | Richards^ | Ponting^ | Pollock | Hammond^ | Worrell5* | Waite+ | Akram3 | Steyn1 | Holding2 | O'Reilly4
    4th XI
    Morris | Simpson^ | Sangakkara | Weekes^ | Border*^ | Walcott+ | Faulkner5 | Laker4 | Trueman1 | Garner3 | Donald2

  7. #67
    State Regular L Trumper's Avatar
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    Can't believe I am the only one who picked Gilly. His contributions in almost all of Australia's great victories during 1999-2004 is never been seen before or since for a WK. It is no coincidence that Australia's true dominance all over the world started with his entrance to the team. Obviously his batting tailed off after 2005 though.

  8. #68
    International Vice-Captain watson's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Monk View Post
    It's funny when we talk about averaging 30 as a bowler as a negative. It's about neutral imo
    I agree. Any bowler with an Average of <30, and a Strike Rate <65 (<75 for a spinner) has had a good series. If it's his career stat's then he is a very good bowler indeed.

    Sometimes I think that we set the bar too high because we spend too much time ogling at Marshall, Imran, and Hadlee.
    Last edited by watson; 11-09-2013 at 08:36 PM.
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  9. #69
    International Vice-Captain Riggins's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by L Trumper View Post
    Can't believe I am the only one who picked Gilly.
    I can't believe Marto wasn't an option. Did none of you watch cricket before Dave Warner came along?
    The sort of general malaise that only the genius possess and the insane lament.

  10. #70
    State Vice-Captain harsh.ag's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Riggins View Post
    I can't believe Marto wasn't an option. Did none of you watch cricket before Dave Warner came along?
    Again, for ones who would like to vote for Marto or Waugh or Haydos are welcome to go for 'Other' and state their preference, at the same time cursing me for not including their names as full time candidates

    But how do you justify Marto being a bigger match-winner than Punter and Gilly? Quite curious.

    As an aside, I was going to point out that Australia had no discernible problems while Warne was banned for 1 year from Feb 03 to Feb 04, but then I saw that they only played Zim, Bang and SL in that period - <Potential for great cricket experiment down the drain>.
    They won the WC easily enough, though of course that shouldn't be given much of a weight.
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  11. #71
    Cricket Web: All-Time Legend Top_Cat's Avatar
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    Reckon the guys who participated might hold a different view.
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  12. #72
    International Vice-Captain Riggins's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by harsh.skm View Post
    But how do you justify Marto being a bigger match-winner than Punter and Gilly? Quite curious.
    Given the fair, consistent and unbiased used of statistics in here I'd probably go for an argument based on the only important series' for that team being away in India and Sri Lanka. Man of the Series in both therefore most valuable. Also if he didn't get sawn off every second day in 2005 we probably win the series.

    And I agree with TC, the WC should have some bearing and Marto's 88* with a shattered finger was maybe the greatest ODI knock of all time.
    harsh.ag and L Trumper like this.

  13. #73
    International Coach Ikki's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by kyear2 View Post
    Very true, nice to know you are coming around slightly, though I know it wouldn't elevate him in your overall ratings.
    Have I ever said otherwise?

    Being in my top 3 fast bowlers of all-time is a high place to be and the reason he isn't outright 1st is something I've discussed before.

  14. #74
    State Vice-Captain Tangles's Avatar
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    Marto? Riggins obviously trollin

  15. #75
    Request Your Custom Title Now! benchmark00's Avatar
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    Hayden went through a period where he was the best player in the world. During that time he bullied opposition into submission, and by the time he was out their backs were broken and the rest of the batting order were left to pick at the carcus.

    Bloke is a grade A cock, but he was phenomenal when on. Reckon he played his part in winning Australia plenty of matches.
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