Life After Flintoff

[Manee]

Something along the lines of Anderson, Onions, Sidebottom & Broad.

That attack seems to me as if it could win in South Africa.

 

[Langeveldt]

You need two players to replace Flintoff at the moment.. I'd go with Sidebottom and Trott.. And lose any two of Bell, Bopara or Harmison

 

[wpdavid]

You need two players to replace Flintoff at the moment.. I'd go with Sidebottom and Trott.. And lose any two of Bell, Bopara or Harmison

Selection for the SA tour is going to be seriously tricky unless a couple of our middle order actually score some runs at the Oval. Apart from Strauss, Cook, KP & Collingwood we'll probably take Trott and any two you care to name from Key, Shah and I dread to think who else. Given that Collingwood's form since Cardiff has been dire in the extreme, he's a bit lucky to be regarded as a certainty, but he does have a decent 12 months behind him.

I think that life post-Fred will initially involve 6 bats, Prior & 4 quicks. If Broad does develop into a genuine test number 7, then it will be easier to play either Swann or Rashid at 8 followed by whichever other 3 quicks we want to play. But as I said earlier, a spinner doesn't strike me as a necessity in SA.

 

[pup11]

Cricket Web - Features: Life After Flintoff

After the Ashes, England's Test side will enter a new era, one where Andrew Flintoff in particular will need to be replaced. How should England balance their team without Flintoff, and who are the likely contenders to join the England squad in the future?

Life after Flintoff is going to be a bit hard, as he has been a real luxury and asset for England over the years.

He has allowed England to play with that extra batsman or bowler, which has always helped England play with a better balanced sides, and his ability to raise the bar of his game against tougher opponents is also something that England would definitely miss.

I don't think Broad has it in him to emulate what Freddie did for England, atleast for some time to come, so therefore England might have to stop playing with the 5 bowlers and pick an extra batsman instead, and of course atm there no clear contender to fill that spot.

 

[tooextracool]

Cook
Strauss
?
Pietersen
Collingwood
Prior
Broad
Bresnan
Swann
Anderson
Onions

Seems like a real "each way" bet though. You've basically picked three bowlers good enough to claim a spot outright, and two bowlers because they bat, and they might be good enough to bowl well.

England can only really contemplate playing 5 specialist batsmen and Prior when they actually have 5 reliable specialist batsmen or thereabouts. As long as they have Cook and ? in the side, that is not really an option.

 

[tooextracool]

Crucially, I noted that this would be doable if Broad grows into the Flintoff role. I don't mean this entirely, but if Broad becomes a more complete bowler, which is the purpose of his grooming, then it will be four bowlers and one fifth bowler who can bat. Bresnan at seven may be necessary for him not to be seen as worse than Broad at batting and bowling, even though this is the likely outcome, but I feel that side can work well.

If Broad doesn't improve, then all current plans that England may have for the future go out of the water, so I think it is fair to assume he does improve.

No matter what people say about how ordinary Broad is at the moment, there is little doubt that for someone who just turned 23, he has accomplished a fair bit in international cricket and has shown a lot of character and the ability to bounce back from adversity.

In an ideal world, Broad should have been made to learn his trade at the domestic level and made his test debut around about right after the Ashes, but now that he has been invested in for a couple of years, it makes sense to stock by him for the indefinite future after the Ashes, especially considering the lack of a truly quality replacement.

 

[Pigeon]

What life after Flintoff now? March '10 is not that far..

 

[FBU]

Well I hope it will be back to 4 bowlers. (Collingwood, KP and Trott can do some part time bowling)

Squad for South Africa

1 Strauss
2 Cook
3 Key
4 Pietersen
5 Trott
6 Collingwood
7 Prior
8 Swann
9 Broad
10 Anderson
11 Onions

Reserves: Panesar, Sidebottom, Read, Joyce, Tremlett
--
21 Tests 701 runs at 30.47 / 663.5 overs 58 wickets at 37.62 econ 3.28 s/r 68.6 - Broad
21 Tests 643 runs at 19.48 / 541.5 overs 33 wickets at 47.15 econ 2.87 s/r 98.5 - Flintoff

 

[aussie]

That attack seems to me as if it could win in South Africa.

If the pitches are like what AUS had early this year. It could be a bowler friendly series TBH.

Since ATM, SA bowling attack could become really dependant on Steyn. So a potential ENG bowling 4-man pace attack, will have to restrict that very strong SA batting-lineup & hope that batting can exploit the weakness in SAs bowling attack behind Steyn.

 

[Top_Cat]

If the pitches are like what AUS had early this year. It could be a bowler friendly series TBH.

I don't recall the pitches being particularly bowler friendly. SA just batted like ****, 3rd Test (on a road) aside. If anything, they turned more than they seamed. There was some swing around, though.

 

[tooextracool]

Well I hope it will be back to 4 bowlers. (Collingwood, KP and Trott can do some part time bowling)

Squad for South Africa

1 Strauss
2 Cook
3 Key
4 Pietersen
5 Trott
6 Collingwood
7 Prior
8 Swann
9 Broad
10 Anderson
11 Onions

Reserves: Panesar, Sidebottom, Read, Joyce, Tremlett
--
21 Tests 701 runs at 30.47 / 663.5 overs 58 wickets at 37.62 econ 3.28 s/r 68.6 - Broad
21 Tests 643 runs at 19.48 / 541.5 overs 33 wickets at 47.15 econ 2.87 s/r 98.5 - Flintoff

Thought it was poor form for them to drop Key on the last tour to SA given that he hadnt really done disastrously on that tour, (not to mention he was only 25 at the time!). However, I fail to see the point of picking someone at the age of 30 when he is barely even setting the county scene alight. Would much rather Bopara or anyone with the slightest possibility of having more than a mediocre future career toured rather than Key now.

 

[JBH001]

Thought this was an interesting article on Freddie.

The Flintoff factor | Opinion | Cricinfo Magazine | Cricinfo.com

 

[slippyslip]

If Flintoff's injuries heal up and he stays injury free (highly unlikely I know) do you think theres any chance he could come back and tour Australia in 2010/11 and play the tests?

 

[JBH001]

He should certainly end up with a better bowling average if he progresses. he has dropped it by about 5 over the last few series and I would like to see this continue (although another 5 off it in a short space of time would obviously be a lot to ask). I would rather see him work on improving his bowling than batting, though again given that he is only about 22/23, you would expect he can still improve this as well. So yeah, if he does enough to stay in the team he might well wind up with a better Test record than Sir Fred, quite staggering to think about it really.

True. Although, I reckon, his true value in the future will come with the bat, and I hope he focusses on his more talented and able area once he gets to consistent decent/good third seamer status. I dont think he has the capacity to be a frontliner - and foisting that kind of responsibility on him might be detrimental to him as a batsman, I think. But the potential is there to become a very good and genuine all-rounder.

Put it this way, I can see him becoming a 30 - 35 average bowler (certainly no lower than high 20s), but a 35+ average batsman.

 

[aussie]

I don't recall the pitches being particularly bowler friendly. SA just batted like ****, 3rd Test (on a road) aside. If anything, they turned more than they seamed. There was some swing around, though.

Yea the 3rd test was a definite road. The pitches in the first 2 test where pretty much perfect test wickets. Enough help for the bowlers & conistent bounce allowing the batsmen to play their shots.