Cant blame the world if they are laughing at us

[Sanz]

Actually I am a Maharashtrian and a Shiv Sainik to boot actively involved in ridding Maharashtra and eventually the entire country of everyone except Maharashtrians hence my declared devotion to Maharsahtrians eg Gavaskar

My ancestors who were holidaying in Poonchh in 1947 were butchered by Bengalis masquerading as Kabayaliees from the mountains and since then (actually from a few years later when I was born) I have always held a special grudge against Bengalis.

My ideal Indian team for the 2007 world cup is :
- Ja Tu Openkar
- Jako Followkar
- Chalja Batkar
- God Tendulkar
- Next Padkar
- Tubhi Padkar
- Wicket Ko Keepkar
- Sairaj Mumbaikar
- Ohmy Agarkar
- Fast Bowlkar
- Superfast Bowlkar

Tujha sabse wadda ipocrytekar

 

[Sudeep]

And isn't Yuvraj Singh a Punjabi too ?? If he and you are going to be so sensitive about this..then dont effing bring Bengalis just because some of them support Ganguly.

Errr... I was particularly referring to this:

Btw...can someone tell me which team Wasim Jaffer plays for ?? Is it Mumbai and isn't where SJS is from ??

It was a discussion on Ganguly. Yes, Jaffer replaced Ganguly, but in SJS's post, I don't see any mention of him. And I don't see how it's related.

 

[Sanz]

Errr... I was particularly referring to this:

Btw...can someone tell me which team Wasim Jaffer plays for ?? Is it Mumbai and isn't where SJS is from ??

It was a discussion on Ganguly. Yes, Jaffer replaced Ganguly, but in SJS's post, I don't see any mention of him. And I don't see how it's related.

If this was a discussion on Ganguly, why bring 'BENGALI' into it ? There are many Bengalis in the world who give too hoot about Ganguly and Cricket.

And SJS is indeed barking about Jaffer on various threads, e.g. :-

"BREAKING NEWS !! Ganguly Dropped. Jaffer in the side for third test

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Well done."



["I]I dont know whether Gambhir will play or Jaffer but even if Gambhir is playing, having Jaffer IN the squad puts ectra pressure on him and this management seemd bent on trying people out under pressure. Not a bad situation.[/I]"


How anyone in his right mind can call the selection of Wasim Jaffer who has an avg. of 20..as 'WELL DONE' move...May be it has something to with the bias.

 

[Sanz]

Here is a report..why some folks are overreacting.

http://www.hindustantimes.com/news/181_1575668,0035.htm

"It was decided that Kiran More would speak to him in his capacity as the selection committee chairman," says a selector. "I don't know what happened, why Kiran did not speak, because he obviously didn't and this didn't make sense. In any case, what happened the next day at the selection meeting overrode everything else, because both captain and coach were definite he had no place in the team."

"Chappell was extremely aggressive, as he always is, and spoke at length against Ganguly," says another selector. "He was hell-bent on ensuring that Ganguly did not make it to the squad. He said Ganguly was dividing the dressing room; that he would not mix with the other players, he refused to speak much or share in the joking around.”

"Chappell said Ganguly had an attitude problem and was a bad fielder. He said having him in the squad would be detrimental to India."

Asked whether there was a discussion on whether Wasim Jaffer ("a unanimous, apolitical choice") could replace Gautam Gambhir, the logical thing to do, sources say Chappell spoke for Gambhir.

"He said Gautam had potential and was already a very reserved person. He thought if we dropped him now, he would withdraw into his shell completely and it would be very difficult to draw him out thereafter."

 

[SJS]

For those who can read English :-

I said this before the team was announced

You are probably right. It is touch and go.

Yuvraj hasnt done his chances any harm by his second innings show but one could say that not scoring in the first innings when runs appeared (at least appeared) to be more difficult to come by could be a 'minor' (very minor I concede) point against him. In the second innings everyone seemed to be scoring runs. Pathan and Dhoni put Yuvraj's second innings performance a bit more in perspective, I suppose.
Yuvraj could count himself unlucky but its tough to be in the same team which has people like Sachin, Dravid, Laxman and Ganguly to compete with. He should be happy and proud of what he has done and bide his time.

Ganguly on the other hand scored in the first too and he was under abnormal pressure.

Touch and go but Ganguly should tip the scale I suppose. I would love Yuvraj to play but I think you are right.

My worry, however, is that Gambhir might fail again. I hope not though

after the team had been announced

You are right to an extent but
1. The way the media has been trying to encash the Ganguly-Chappell fiasco there would have been a controversy whatever the selectors did
2. There are eleven players for the eventual side and four on the bench. These include one spinner (Murali Karthik), one new ball bowler (RP), one middle order bat (Kaif) and, now, one opener. This seems right. They had it wrong when they tried to show, before the first test, that this wasnt the case and put Ganguly in there as an all rounder.
3. I dont know whether Gambhir will play or Jaffer but even if Gambhir is playing, having Jaffer IN the squad puts ectra pressure on him and this management seemd bent on trying people out under pressure. Not a bad situation.

Having said that, I think they still handled this very badly.

1) Getting Ganguly in by the backdoor (this all rounder bit) was silly. They should have taken him as a batsman or not at all. I know this was done by an earlier selection committee but then it should have been clarified after the committee was changed that he was playing purely as batsman. Calling him all rounder, justifying his inclusion over Zaheer with that and then not bowling him even once in this test is bound to have a reaction.
3. Having selected Ganguly, they should have decided what they want to do with him.
- If they had made up his mind that this was his swan song, he should have been told so at the beginning of the series and then played in all three games and given the respect and the fitting farewell that he deserved at the end of such a glorious career.
- If they wanted to treat him like any other player then they should have let him be in the squad for the third test and let Dravid decide on the day of the match whether he wants him in the final eleven or not.
4. The amount of muck the media has been raising for more than a month now isnt funny. The board should have gone ahead got their stance on this clarified through a proper communication be it a press conference or a specific statement. Letting speculations and allegations fly thick and fast and pretending that nothing is happening only made things more difficult for the selectors and very awkward for the captain and coach.

This should have been avoided at all cost.

My personal take is EITHER Ganguly should have been told his career is over at the beginning OR he should have been told this is his last series OR he should have been told he will be played for all three games and his future decided on his performance, those of others and all other ramifications of his being in the team (call it his conduct if you please) at the end of the series.

This is a mess and the authorities have to take some blame for at least the poor handling of a delicate situation.

Now its done and we should go ahead and play some cricket. Going on and on about it can do nothing but harm.

PS: One thing that I forgot. While I am a strong advocate of an opener being a specialist, going into the second test WITHOUT one seemed to be odd. Why didnt they remember to get a specialist opener then? This opens them to the allegation that this was to get Yuvraj in and now that he has got his runs they dont need that excuse. Someone is bound to say that if Yuvraj had scored fewer runs, they may have still opened with Pathan or someone else.

AND FOR THOSE BORN WITH BLINKERS my attitude has always been....



and I love it

 

[Sanz]

Yeah once again SJS forgot to quote his post which started this argument, :-

But dont you believe that. Parliament is now going to debate whether Ganguly should play for India. The Defense Minister of India(a Bengali by coincidence), the leaders of the communist parties (all Bengalis by another coincidence, The speaker of the Lok Sabha (yet another Bengali believe it or not) are in the forefront to make it the issue that has sent all other matters of national importance out of the window.

Wow !! look who brought regionalism into this discussion.

 

[Sanz]

Yeah Look was letting people know of Jaffer's double century against Delhi..much before the team for the first test was announced :-

25th Nov. 2005

Look at today's head lines in Indian papers. Ganguly's 81 not out is claiming screaming headlines. Who said Ganguly isnt capable of scoring runs in Ranji Trophy. But thats not a criteria for selection to the Indian team for him. How come most people havent noticed Jaffer svored 257 yesterday in another Ranji match against a stronger Delhi side ?

Jeez since when the attack of Bhandari , Kunal Lal ,Nanda , Sarandeep Singh, Bali ,Bhatia became stronger than Bahutule, Munaf Patel, Jadhav, Sanclecha, Burkul...But some people would have us believe that...

And I was not surprised to hear these people patting the selection committee with comments like 'WELL DONE' after JAffer was selected.

Btw..Ganguly scored 159 against that attack..Also the same Jaffer when played against the decent attack of Bengal scored a massive 28 runs in two innings..against the bose, Paul & co.

 

[Sanz]

But dont you believe that. Parliament is now going to debate whether Ganguly should play for India. The Defense Minister of India(a Bengali by coincidence), the leaders of the communist parties (all Bengalis by another coincidence, The speaker of the Lok Sabha (yet another Bengali believe it or not) are in the forefront to make it the issue that has sent all other matters of national importance out of the window.

Incase you didn't know Sambit BAL iwhose 'Sad but Right' post you quoted is a Bengali as well, Here is another Bengali (although a probasi Bengali - I hope you understand the meaning of the word) writting for the outlook :-
http://www.outlookindia.com/full.asp?fodname=20051216&fname=ganguly&sid=1&pn=1

There are many..but a biased poerson like you wont notice this. Blinkers on..

 

[Sanz]

The Guy who said "He should concentrate on his arm, rather than talk about whether Ganguly is right or wrong ... once a chucker always a chucker". a few weeks ago about Harbhajan singh is now going to Pakistan as Indian Team Manager.

http://www.icc-cricket.com/ci/content/story/220178.html

Dungarpur made team manager

New Delhi: Former BCCI president Raj Singh Dungarpur has been made team manager for India's tour of Pakistan early next year.

Talking to UNI over phone, Board of Control for Cricket in India (BCCI), secretary Niranjan Shah said, "Yes, we have decided to name him as the team manager when the cricket team tours Pakistan. But we would come up with a formal announcement on December 24."

Asked whether the Board had also finalised the media manager, Mr. Shah said, "we are working on it and we would be able to announce the name hopefully by tomorrow."

Mr. Dungarpur was the manager in India's 1984-85 tour of Pakistan. Very recently, he was there on a personal invite from Pakistan Cricket Board chairman Shaharyar Khan and he watched the second one-dayer between England and Pakistan before holding a meeting with PCB officials on a number of issues. — UNI

http://www.hindu.com/2005/12/22/stories/2005122210692000.htm

 

[Deja moo]

Dungarpur is an A Grade donkey hole. Ever notice how he manages to swing so many games to the CCI ? And now all the time hes spent sucking upto the Pawar faction is paying for for him.

I dont even think anyone in the team likes him. Did you notice Sehwag specifically mentioning the present manager, Baladitya's name, as a major contributor to the series victory alongwith the main support cast ? Managers arent ordinarily thanked by captains publicly. I think it had to do with the players making clear their preferences.

 

[honestbharani]

Here is a report..why some folks are overreacting.

http://www.hindustantimes.com/news/181_1575668,0035.htm

"It was decided that Kiran More would speak to him in his capacity as the selection committee chairman," says a selector. "I don't know what happened, why Kiran did not speak, because he obviously didn't and this didn't make sense. In any case, what happened the next day at the selection meeting overrode everything else, because both captain and coach were definite he had no place in the team."

"Chappell was extremely aggressive, as he always is, and spoke at length against Ganguly," says another selector. "He was hell-bent on ensuring that Ganguly did not make it to the squad. He said Ganguly was dividing the dressing room; that he would not mix with the other players, he refused to speak much or share in the joking around.”

"Chappell said Ganguly had an attitude problem and was a bad fielder. He said having him in the squad would be detrimental to India."

Asked whether there was a discussion on whether Wasim Jaffer ("a unanimous, apolitical choice") could replace Gautam Gambhir, the logical thing to do, sources say Chappell spoke for Gambhir.

"He said Gautam had potential and was already a very reserved person. He thought if we dropped him now, he would withdraw into his shell completely and it would be very difficult to draw him out thereafter."

Sanz, do you honestly think indiatimes is a dependable source? I have never believed any of their exclusives and honestly, I don't think I ever will.

 

[honestbharani]

First of all, while I don't think regionalism has anything to do with it, I do think that the fact that elections are due in a year or so in Bengal is the reason why so many political leaders with stakes in that state are taking up this issue and making such a big deal out of it. That MAY have been SJS's point and if it was, I think he was perfectly justified in bringing it up, because I think everyone (esp. Sourav himself) should realize that Laloo, Jaitley, Dalmiya and others basically care SQUAT about him. It is their game now and he is a pawn in their hands.


Secondly, to respond to Deja's post, I think that Baladitya would stay on as the media manager for the side.

 

[Sanz]

Sanz, do you honestly think indiatimes is a dependable source? I have never believed any of their exclusives and honestly, I don't think I ever will.

That was Hindustantimes, it's a different newspaper.

 

[honestbharani]

I have seen their stuff too. Not very believable, IMHO.