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Why Murali does not throw

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John the Bookie

Cricket Spectator
The reason why a lot of people believe Murali chucks is because of incorrect arguing by Murali supporters. They always say that its a optical illusion that Murali throw and also says that he throw as much as anyone else but they all miss the fundamental reason why Murali doesn't throw.

Definition of a legal delivery from Cricinfo
3. Definition of fair delivery – the arm
A ball is fairly delivered in respect of the arm if, once the bowler's arm has reached the level of the shoulder in the delivery swing, the elbow joint is not straightened partially or completely from that point until the ball has left the hand. This definition shall not debar a bowler from flexing or rotating the wrist in the delivery swing.

Most people simply don't know what a throw is. To summarise the law, a throw is a straightening of the arm from a bent position when delivering the ball. Of course for most people, to prevent the straightening the arm is to bowl with a straight arm. However it is possible to bowl a legal delivery with a bent arm action as long as the bent arm doesn't straighten which is impossible for most people. The thing that makes Murali unique is that he is double jointed so he cannot straighten his arm fully. People say that this deformity allows him to break the law but that is untrue. His deformity allows him to bowl a legal delivery with a bent arm action which makes him unique from every bowler in history. Because of the misconception of the laws of throwing, people just look at the photo of Murali bowling with a bent arm and just assume he chucks. However the only way to prove he is chucking is to find a video of him bowling where his bent arm is straightening which I bet no one can find. In that sense there is no "optical illusion" because it is blatantly obvious he doesn't straighten his arm (as much as anyone else) when bowling.

Now the recent research about the throwing laws has shown that a straight arm from a person without a deformity is not exactly 180 degrees straight and that there is a slight angle in the arm. So when bowling there is a involuntary straightening of the arm. So that is why bowlers like McGrath, Pollock and Harmison chuck without us knowing it. There is a slight straightening of the arm from an already relatively straight position. With Murali, there is a slight straightening of the arm from a bent arm position but it is just as legal (or illegal) as the previous bowlers i just mention. So the research didn't really exonerate Murali because if people knew the action throwing laws there really shouldn't really be a case against him. The research just shows that every bowler involuntarily straightens his arm.

Thanks for reading
 

John the Bookie

Cricket Spectator
steds said:
YAWN!!!!!!!! Another Murali chucks/doesn't chuck(delete as applicable) thread. BORING!!!!! :sleep:





I didn't...
I apologize for boring you. It just the debates are still going around and I'm still annoyed by the insufficient arguments that the Murali supporters are using to defend him.
 
I recently had a discussion on my award winning talkback radio show where i asked my many listeners to call and in give their opinion on the Murali throwing subject. By a vote of nearly 10 - 1 my intelligent, well-informed listeners branded Murali a chucker. This strong a majority can not be wrong in my opinion and I think the cricketing authorities should sit up and take notive of this poll result.

John Laws CBE
 

Jono

Virat Kohli (c)
Hey give the guy a break, he's new to the board.

Anyway John The Bookie, basically the Murali debate has been done to death on Cricket Web, and it usually ends up becoming a topic full of the same old arguments before. The Murali lovers vs. The Murali haters spouting statistic after statistic if its about Warne vs. Murali, or if its about whether he throws or not it really has nothing more than "Well I think he throws", "Well its proven he doesn't" "I don't care, I think he throws".

You'd best leave the Murali debate alone, its been quiet for a few weeks now. The board is better off. :)

Edit: I hope this John The Bookie isn't another of those personalities going around, where the same poster just spams the board. Then you can attack him all you like I guess. :sleep:
 

John the Bookie

Cricket Spectator
Jono said:
Hey give the guy a break, he's new to the board.

Anyway John The Bookie, basically the Murali debate has been done to death on Cricket Web, and it usually ends up becoming a topic full of the same old arguments before. The Murali lovers vs. The Murali haters spouting statistic after statistic if its about Warne vs. Murali, or if its about whether he throws or not it really has nothing more than "Well I think he throws", "Well its proven he doesn't" "I don't care, I think he throws".

You'd best leave the Murali debate alone, its been quiet for a few weeks now. The board is better off. :)

Edit: I hope this John The Bookie isn't another of those personalities going around, where the same poster just spams the board. Then you can attack him all you like I guess. :sleep:
Okay, I will not post another Murali chucking thread at this site. I'm just frustrated at the anti-murali sentiment around and I remember reading Inside Cricket and they basically pay him out every issue.
And no I'm not spamming the board
 

Marcus

School Boy/Girl Cricketer
He dosent chuck becasuse he has a massive legal backing behind him, he does chuck, although the ICC dont want a legal case vs. them so they change the rules. Now he 'illegal' bowls properly. its laughable
 

Neil Pickup

Cricket Web Moderator
Marcus said:
He dosent chuck becasuse he has a massive legal backing behind him, he does chuck, although the ICC dont want a legal case vs. them so they change the rules. Now he 'illegal' bowls properly. its laughable
And so does everybody else, except Ramnaresh. One more piece of uninformed diatribe from anyone and this thread gets closed...
 

a massive zebra

International Vice-Captain
Neil Pickup said:
And so does everybody else, except Ramnaresh. One more piece of uninformed diatribe from anyone and this thread gets closed...
How is this for uninformed diatribe....


The United States is 49th in the world in literacy (the New York Times, Dec. 12, 2004).

The United States ranked 28th out of 40 countries in mathematical literacy (NYT, Dec. 12, 2004).

Twenty percent of Americans think the sun orbits the earth. Seventeen percent believe the earth revolves around the sun once a day (The Week, Jan. 7, 2005).

"The International Adult Literacy Survey...found that Americans with less than nine years of education 'score worse than virtually all of the other countries'" (Jeremy Rifkin's superbly documented book The European Dream: How Europe's Vision of the Future Is Quietly Eclipsing the American Dream, p.78 ).

Our workers are so ignorant and lack so many basic skills that American businesses spend $30 billion a year on remedial training (NYT, Dec. 12, 2004). No wonder they relocate elsewhere!

"The European Union leads the U.S. in...the number of science and engineering graduates; public research and development (R&D) expenditures; and new capital raised" (The European Dream, p.70).

"Europe surpassed the United States in the mid-1990s as the largest producer of scientific literature" (The European Dream, p.70).

Nevertheless, Congress cut funds to the National Science Foundation. The agency will issue 1,000 fewer research grants this year (NYT, Dec. 21, 2004).

Foreign applications to U.S. grad schools declined 28 percent last year. Foreign student enrollment on all levels fell for the first time in three decades, but increased greatly in Europe and China. Last year Chinese grad-school graduates in the U.S. dropped 56 percent, Indians 51 percent, South Koreans 28 percent (NYT, Dec. 21, 2004).

We're not the place to be anymore. The World Health Organization "ranked the countries of the world in terms of overall health performance, and the U.S. [was]...37th." In the fairness of health care, we're 54th. "The irony is that the United States spends more per capita for health care than any other nation in the world" (The European Dream, pp.79-80).

Pay more, get lots, lots less.
"The U.S. and South Africa are the only two developed countries in the world that do not provide health care for all their citizens" (The European Dream, p.80). Excuse me, but since when is South Africa a "developed" country? Anyway, that's the company we're keeping.

Lack of health insurance coverage causes 18,000 unnecessary American deaths a year. (That's six times the number of people killed on 9/11.) (NYT, Jan. 12, 2005.)

"U.S. childhood poverty now ranks 22nd, or second to last, among the developed nations. Only Mexico scores lower" (The European Dream, p.81). Been to Mexico lately? Does it look "developed" to you? Yet it's the only "developed" country to score lower in childhood poverty.

Twelve million American families--more than 10 percent of all U.S. households--"continue to struggle, and not always successfully, to feed themselves." Families that "had members who actually went hungry at some point last year" numbered 3.9 million (NYT, Nov. 22, 2004).

The United States is 41st in the world in infant mortality. Cuba scores higher (NYT, Jan. 12, 2005).

Women are 70 percent more likely to die in childbirth in America than in Europe (NYT, Jan. 12, 2005).

The leading cause of death of pregnant women in this country is murder (CNN, Dec. 14, 2004).

"Of the 20 most developed countries in the world, the U.S. was dead last in the growth rate of total compensation to its workforce in the 1980s.... In the 1990s, the U.S. average compensation growth rate grew only slightly, at an annual rate of about 0.1 percent" (The European Dream, p.39). Yet Americans work longer hours per year than any other industrialized country, and get less vacation time.

"Sixty-one of the 140 biggest companies on the Global Fortune 500 rankings are European, while only 50 are U.S. companies" (The European Dream, p.66).

"In a recent survey of the world's 50 best companies, conducted by Global Finance, all but one were European" (The European Dream, p.69).

"Fourteen of the 20 largest commercial banks in the world today are European.... In the chemical industry, the European company BASF is the world's leader, and three of the top six players are European.

In engineering and construction, three of the top five companies are European.... The two others are Japanese. Not a single American engineering and construction company is included among the world's top nine competitors.

In food and consumer products, Nestlé and Unilever, two European giants, rank first and second, respectively, in the world.

In the food and drugstore retail trade, two European companies...are first and second, and European companies make up five of the top ten. Only four U.S. companies are on the list" (The European Dream, p.68 ).

The United States has lost 1.3 million jobs to China in the last decade (CNN, Jan. 12, 2005).

U.S. employers eliminated 1 million jobs in 2004 (The Week, Jan. 14, 2005).

Three million six hundred thousand Americans ran out of unemployment insurance last year; 1.8 million--one in five--unemployed workers are jobless for more than six months (NYT, Jan. 9, 2005).

Japan, China, Taiwan, and South Korea hold 40 percent of our government debt. (That's why we talk nice to them.) "By helping keep mortgage rates from rising, China has come to play an enormous and little-noticed role in sustaining the American housing boom" (NYT, Dec. 4, 2004). Read that twice. We owe our housing boom to China, because they want us to keep buying all that stuff they manufacture.

Sometime in the next 10 years Brazil will probably pass the U.S. as the world's largest agricultural producer. Brazil is now the world's largest exporter of chickens, orange juice, sugar, coffee, and tobacco. Last year, Brazil passed the U.S. as the world's largest beef producer. (Hear that, you poor deluded cowboys?) As a result, while we bear record trade deficits, Brazil boasts a $30 billion trade surplus (NYT, Dec. 12, 2004).

As of last June, the U.S. imported more food than it exported (NYT, Dec. 12, 2004).

Bush: 62,027,582 votes. Kerry: 59,026,003 votes. Number of eligible voters who didn't show up: 79,279,000 (NYT, Dec. 26, 2004). That's more than a third. Way more. If more than a third of Iraqis don't show for their election, no country in the world will think that election legitimate.

One-third of all U.S. children are born out of wedlock. One-half of all U.S. children will live in a one-parent house (CNN, Dec. 10, 2004).

"Americans are now spending more money on gambling than on movies, videos, DVDs, music, and books combined" (The European Dream, p.28 ).

"Nearly one out of four Americans [believe] that using violence to get what they want is acceptable" (The European Dream, p.32).

Forty-three percent of Americans think torture is sometimes justified, according to a PEW Poll (Associated Press, Aug. 19, 2004).

"Nearly 900,000 children were abused or neglected in 2002, the last year for which such data are available" (USA Today, Dec. 21, 2004).

"The International Association of Chiefs of Police said that cuts by the [Bush] administration in federal aid to local police agencies have left the nation more vulnerable than ever" (USA Today, Nov. 17, 2004).
 

John the Bookie

Cricket Spectator
Seems like nobody care.

hey massive zebra. Where did you get all that information from.

a massive zebra said:
Forty-three percent of Americans think torture is sometimes justified, according to a PEW Poll (Associated Press, Aug. 19, 2004).
To be fair on the American, this is the growing trend around the world. In Australia in a similar poll, over 50% of Australian believes that torture is sometimes justified which seems worrying. I heard recently that President Bush made laws allowing the President of USA to be not liable for any damages if torture take place in America.
 

Richard

Cricket Web Staff Member
John the Bookie said:
In Australia in a similar poll, over 50% of Australian believes that torture is sometimes justified which seems worrying.
Physical torture is never justifiable.
Mental torture is always so.
 

Richard

Cricket Web Staff Member
John Laws CBE said:
I recently had a discussion on my award winning talkback radio show where i asked my many listeners to call and in give their opinion on the Murali throwing subject. By a vote of nearly 10 - 1 my intelligent, well-informed listeners branded Murali a chucker. This strong a majority can not be wrong in my opinion and I think the cricketing authorities should sit up and take notive of this poll result.
Just goes to show how ill-informed John Laws' lot are, really.
 

Richard

Cricket Web Staff Member
Marcus said:
He dosent chuck becasuse he has a massive legal backing behind him, he does chuck, although the ICC dont want a legal case vs. them so they change the rules. Now he 'illegal' bowls properly. its laughable
Any evidence on that?
It'd be interesting if anyone thought they could concoct a case against ICC for not changing the rules.
 

Richard

Cricket Web Staff Member
John the Bookie said:
I apologize for boring you. It just the debates are still going around and I'm still annoyed by the insufficient arguments that the Murali supporters are using to defend him.
Yes, me too, but all threads end-up going down the same route.
 

Belford

Banned
Dumb

"Physical torture is never justifiable.
Mental torture is always so."


Perhaps you would like to speak to a few people who have undergone psychological torture at the hands of secret police etc, and revise this sensationally dumb statement.
 
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