Do England have a problem with finishing games off?

[open365]

In test matches, England always seem to play there best when they've got their backs against the wall and someone comes through for the team. I put this down to confidence of winning so much over the last 3 years.

In ODIs however, i think we just aren't very good, we have problems doing most things in ODIs.

 

[Richard]

England's recent return to power has been great, but have some bad habits from the Atherton/Hussain era carried over?

Err, how on Earth is it Atherton or Hussain's fault? The worst of times were over by the time they captained the team - at least we actually managed to get into winning positions with them at the helm.

 

[Richard]

Jones is nowhere close to being good enough to bat #7 in a world-class team, which England certainly is.

Err, how on Earth are England a World-class ODI team? We're not close.
Read is a better one-day batsman than Jones, but to call us World-class is stupid.

 

[Richard]

Jones is a fairly average batsman, it must be said. He's certainly worse with the bat than the keepers in any of the other top 8 test sides. Gilchrist, Sangakkara, Dhoni, Akmal, Boucher, McCullum and Ramdin are all better batsmen generally, though Ramdin is probably pretty close.

He's still better than Harbhajan though.

Really, how on Earth are McCullum or Ramdin so definitively better?

 

[Richard]

In ODI's England certainly have problems finishing games off as the first two games against India have shown, i think they have the potential to be a very good side in one day cricket they just havnt got the mental capacity that they now have in tests.

Purely and simply - with Collingwood, Blackwell, Jones and the like in the batting-line-up, it's hardly a surprise that England don't score lower-order runs.
Nor, with Plunkett, Kabir Ali and the like in the attack is the failure to defend decent scores surprising.

 

[Richard]

Exactly, I was surprised to discover yesterday that he's nearly 30. Not at all young. If he was playing for India, he would've been dismissed as an impotent batsman without any future and his effigies would've been burnt by now. Good thing he doesn't.

Seriously though, shouldn't there be better wicketkeeping prospects in England? Just like India and Australia, England has plenty of cricketers and a pretty huge development system as well. Surely Geraint can't be tops.

Well - has Matthew Prior (who is supposedly 2nd-best) really looked anything other than even worse?

 

[Richard]

Regarding Geraint Jones, I personally think he has a lot talent as a batsman, and will be a very useful Test batsman as soon as he straightens out his defensive technique a little and starts playing with a little more confidence. He does need to learn how to bat in ODIs, though - he's in danger of losing his place.

I really don't think he has what it takes to learn to bat in ODIs - and he should never have been picked for them.

 

[Jono]

Really, how on Earth are McCullum or Ramdin so definitively better?

Its pretty obvious McCullum is a better batsman than Jones, simply because McCullum is actually good as something specifically, batting at the death and running between the wickets making 1s into 2s and 2s into 3s.

The only thing Geraint is good at in ODIs is gifting his wicket to the opposition.

 

[SJS]

Do England have a problem with finishing games off?

Of course not !!!

Its just that they themselves get "finished off'" while there is a bit of the game still left. Thats not their fault.

 

[adharcric]

Well - has Matthew Prior (who is supposedly 2nd-best) really looked anything other than even worse?

Yes, he's looked better than Jones with the bat.

 

[adharcric]

Err, how on Earth are England a World-class ODI team? We're not close.
Read is a better one-day batsman than Jones, but to call us World-class is stupid.

I was referring to a World-Class Test Side. As for ODIs, England are far from world-class but seeing Jones coming in a few spots after Pietersen and Flintoff and being expected to contribute is pathetic.

 

[GIMH]

He was looking alright today, great partnership with Collingwood

 

[adharcric]

Yes today he did well. Consistency is the key though.

 

[GIMH]

Yeah, that's Geraint problem, I personally don't doubt he has the talent to succeed, but he almost always seems to follow up a good innings with a single figure score, he gets himself out before he gets in trying to play shots you should only play once you're in.

 

[open365]

Yeah, that's Geraint problem, I personally don't doubt he has the talent to succeed, but he almost always seems to follow up a good innings with a single figure score, he gets himself out before he gets in trying to play shots you should only play once you're in.

I doubt both, Jones has had more than enough chances to prove he's good enough, and from his career so far, i don't think that he has.

He has shown on occasions that he can play good innings such as his 85 at Trent Bridge and his 80 against Australia in the ODI final but he has never had a good run of form with the bat or gloves and he's been playing for 2 years now which leads me to think that'll he'll never be anything better than he is at present.

 

[superkingdave]

I think his problem is that he averages 17.75 in ODI's and only has one score greater than 37 in 27 innings

 

[open365]

I think his problem is that he averages 17.75 in ODI's and only has one score greater than 37 in 27 innings

I knew his record wasn't special, but that's awful.

The problem is with Jones is that he only has to score one average knock a series and his place is secured because everyone thinks Chris Read is worse than a tail ender.

 

[superkingdave]

well its his average against proper opposition, which makes a bit of difference since he scored 2 half centuries against Zimbabwe but even with those in he only averages 22

 

[Richard]

Its pretty obvious McCullum is a better batsman than Jones, simply because McCullum is actually good as something specifically, batting at the death and running between the wickets making 1s into 2s and 2s into 3s.

The only thing Geraint is good at in ODIs is gifting his wicket to the opposition.

I was actually meaning in Tests, but while McCullum might be a better ODI batsman than Jones I still don't think he's anything remotely special.
22 plays 17 - there's not that much in it IMO.

 

[Richard]

Yes, he's looked better than Jones with the bat.

Has he? That's escaped me. Every time I've watched him, be it in Pakistan, India or domestically, he's looked largely useless.
Opening the batting is a privilaged position in the limited-overs game, and Prior has done absolutely nothing to warrant it.
Nor had Jones when he got the chance thrust upon him (and averaged less than 20 - almost exactly the same as Prior).
Surely time must be running-out for him and quite rightly.