Battle of the Batting Orders

[BazBall21]

I think they have the lower floor very Arguably. The only place I think they have a fair chance is in NZ and England, but I won't right off India complete there as well. Think overall India got it pretty convincingly.

Across conditions, South Africa have the more efficient unit.

 

[capt_Luffy]

Across conditions, South Africa have the more efficient unit.

Only in NZ and England, everywhere else India.

 

[BazBall21]

Only in NZ and England, everywhere else India.

I'd take SA's quartet anywhere outside Asia, and they're better in Asia than India are elsewhere.

 

[capt_Luffy]

I'd take SA's quartet anywhere outside Asia, and they're better in Asia than India are elsewhere.

I Disagree hard. I will take India in both AUS, WI. And think overall it's close in England, NZ and SA. And also think it's just Not Close in Asia.

 

[BazBall21]

I Disagree hard. I will take India in both AUS, WI. And think overall it's close in England, NZ and SA. And also think it's just Not Close in Asia.

SA feasted in WI and are very strong in Asia. Not convinced by Sehwag in Australia, would take each of SA's options over him. Probably each of them over Dravid in Australia too. India have multiple potential weak points in some conditions outside Asia. SA don't have that downside.

 

[Sliferxxxx]

Abd and co
Viv and co
Inzi and co
Hobbs and co

Which batting orders provide the most for an average team?

Sehwag, Dravid, Tendulkar and Laxman or G Smith, Amla, Kallis and ABD?

Haynes, Greenidge, Viv, Richardson, Lloyd or Langer, Hayden, Ponting and Waugh brothers?

Gavaskar, Vishwanath, Vengsarkar, Amaranth or Anwar, Inzi, Yousuf and Salim Malik?

Hobbs, Sutcliffe Hammond and Jardine or Brown, Morris, Bradman and Miller or Worrell, Weekes, Walcott and Sobers?

Excellent topic. Here goes:

Indian
Tie. Gun to head WI
Pakistani
English

 

[subshakerz]

SA feasted in WI and are very strong in Asia. Not convinced by Sehwag in Australia, would take each of SA's options over him. Probably each of them over Dravid in Australia too. India have multiple potential weak points in some conditions outside Asia. SA don't have that downside.

Yeah SA are basically strong everywhere.

 

[BazBall21]

Yeah SA are basically strong everywhere.

I'd take that over the team that has a tailender in some conditions.

 

[capt_Luffy]

SA feasted in WI and are very strong in Asia. Not convinced by Sehwag in Australia, would take each of SA's options over him. Probably each of them over Dravid in Australia too. India have multiple potential weak points in some conditions outside Asia. SA don't have that downside.

I will take all of Tendulkar and Laxman over SA too. Dravid and Sachin scored in WI when they actually had Great bowlers. India have significant strengths as well, SA lack those.

 

[BazBall21]

I will take all of Tendulkar and Laxman over SA too. Dravid and Sachin scored in WI when they actually had Great bowlers. India have significant strengths as well, SA lack those.

Tendulkar is first in Australian conditions, but again SAF come out on top there as a unit.

Pretty outlandish to suggest Jacques Kallis, AB De Villiers, Hashim Amla and Graeme Smith lacked significant strengths. They have high maximum threshold and a higher overall minimum threshold.

 

[capt_Luffy]

Tendulkar is first in Australian conditions, but again SAF come out on top there as a unit.

Pretty outlandish to suggest Jacques Kallis, AB De Villiers, Hashim Amla and Graeme Smith lacked significant strengths. They have high maximum threshold and a higher overall minimum threshold.

I think overall Indians prevail in Australia.

Yes, I do think none of them had Tendulkar's overall brilliance, Dravid's English record, Sehwag's record in SC and Laxman's clutch.

 

[BazBall21]

I think overall Indians prevail in Australia.

Yes, I do think none of them had Tendulkar's overall brilliance, Dravid's English record, Sehwag's record in SC and Laxman's clutch.

I'd take Smith over Sehwag, Amla over Dravid and De Villiers over Laxman in Australia.

Laxman's "clutch" doesn't make him a more useful batsman than any of the four South African players.

 

[capt_Luffy]

I'd take Smith over Sehwag, Amla over Dravid and De Villiers over Laxman in Australia.

Laxman's "clutch" doesn't make him a more useful batsman than any of the four South African players.

Think all 3 are quite Close, Sachin vs Kallis in Australia isn't.

No it doesn't. But arguably being one of the 3 most "clutch" batsmen ever certainly adds some fair amount of value.

 

[BazBall21]

Think all 3 are quite Close, Sachin vs Kallis in Australia isn't.

No it doesn't. But arguably being one of the 3 most "clutch" batsmen ever certainly adds some fair amount of value.

Of course he was valuable, but I don't think he was better than any of the 8 players in the conversation except Sehwag.

 

[capt_Luffy]

Of course he was valuable, but I don't think he was better than any of the 8 players in the conversation except Sehwag.

Me too, but I don't think the difference between him and say Graeme Smith is "gargantuan".

 

[BazBall21]

Me too, but I don't think the difference between him and say Graeme Smith is "gargantuan".

Yeah it isn't.

 

[MasterBlaster24]

I'd take Smith over Sehwag, Amla over Dravid and De Villiers over Laxman in Australia.

Laxman's "clutch" doesn't make him a more useful batsman than any of the four South African players.

In Australia, why are you choosing G Smith over Sehwag?

 

[BazBall21]

In Australia, why are you choosing G Smith over Sehwag?

Smith was a better player of pace

 

[BazBall21]

Would need to conduct research on who was more prolific in those situations before making a conclusion there but the strength of the tailenders they were batting with would also make an impact so it would be hard to judge. I am a big fan of Thorpe and he accumulated a lot of not outs too but his scope in all manner of tough conditions holds up very well as Waugh's does too.

Thorpe's RPI also suffered from playing for a struggling team with a poor tail. RPI can be a limited comparison metric in some cases, but I think it's decent for Lloyd and Waugh because they batted in similar positions for generally a strong side (especially in the second half of their careers).

 

[MasterBlaster24]

Smith was a better player of pace

Ok. I asked that question because G. Smith struggled against any Australian bowling attack that was remotely close to good. And he struggled massively against McWarne. At least Sehwag did well vs. McWarne in home conditions. And, iirc, Sehwag outscored G. Smith in that World XI game, which both of them played. I know G. Smith is better than Sehwag against pace bowling, but do you choose G. Smith over Sehwag in Australia knowing that G. Smith hasn't played well against Australia? Even in Australia, I do think Sehwag's record is better than G Smith's.