subshakerz
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Rotation requires being dropped from games
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Ashwin vs Jadeja
- Thread starter subshakerz
- Start date
The person who did so must've been confused for a second by your brief moment of intelligence. Let them be disabused of this notion from now on.
You didn't say that though, so too bad.
I mean if we're talking about home pitches Jadeja was a bigger standout than Ashwin/Kumble, though you can always argue about what pitches they played on. Away from home I don't disagree, Kumble generally was forced to bowl a lot because of a lack of pace options in SENA, compared to Ashwin/Jadeja who did get a proper pace attack with them from about 2016 onwards.
I mean even now in the latest England tour, Jadeja/Washington didn't bowl a lot anyway because of the perceived effectiveness of the pacers, and I'd say they're not much better than what Kumble bowled with bar Bumrah.
If it affects your evaluation, then you really don't have a mass of neurons in your head. An amoeba would get my point about this.
Coronis
Cricket Web: All-Time Legend
I’d be quite shocked
CricAddict
International Coach
Glad to know you are a Tendulkar fan. Biggest fan is contentious though with me also being in this forum.
Yeah I accept that your views are genuine from your pov but you don't accept when people explain you the logic of why you are wrong in some cases. Most people don't accept that they are wrong (Flower's keeping for me a case in point) but you never do which riles people.
Back to the topic, Imo Ashwin and Jadeja are so obviously better than Kumble and easily get into India atg XI over him with bowling being equal, batting and fielding far above. I dont think Kumble or any other spinner would have fared much better than Ash-Jaddu in the pitches they got away from home but you are never going to accept that point. There is a reason why most India opposition went with 4 pacers and no spinner at their home. And India too sometimes dropped both Ash-Jaddu on those pitches.
You bringing up percentage of matches played away for Kumble vis-a-vis Ashwin and Jadeja is such a lame point when his competition is Harbhajan Singh and pitch rigging was also not so blatant those days. Both you and I know that it is not a fair point.
Debatable, he'll understand when the bowler it's being used against is Imran Khan, but not here.
subshakerz
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The point is Kumble didn't have the luxury which affected his numbers.
CricAddict
International Coach
So, you agree Kumble wasn't effective on unhelpful pitches at home. But you take away points for Ash-Jaddu when they are not effective on unhelpful pitches away.
Ashwin and Jadeja didn't exactly have the best of conditions either. Sure they weren't needed as much but that doesn't mean that they were helped out a lot on those pitches.
subshakerz
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If you accept my views are genuine then don't claim I have some agenda on Jadeja or Ashwin.
I have revised my opinions. For examples, Kallis bowling recently when I was being accused of being anti Kallis. I also upgraded Jadejas batting rating and I now consider him more of a lock in an Indian ATG XI over Ashwin, based on your arguments to me.
I'm not as inflexible as you think I am.
subshakerz
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Kumble was more effective away on unhelpful pitches.
Kumble was just as effective on home helpful pitches.
Ash Jadeja didn't really play much on home unhelpful pitches over a stretch of time, not counting the odd series.
subshakerz
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Again they don't have to play as much on them
That doesn't mean it helped them either? Lower sample size can distort quality both ways you know.
CricAddict
International Coach
One can be having genuine views and also have an agenda. Happens when that view strongly perceives something and so an agenda is set forth to prove that view right. Everyone does that. So I don't think it is bad.
Good to know that you lock Jadeja over Ashwin in the Indian XI.
subshakerz
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Sure but you brought average into, hence this argument comes up since Kumble would be more effected. And pitches in his time were so much flatter home and away.
subshakerz
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Dude when you explained to me, I realised that Jadejas batting has clearly overcome their bowling difference by now.
That's my entire rationale for this thread, seeing if others agree that Jadeja is ahead of Ashwin for this side. Not some agenda.
Again, it could've gone either way still. The home pitches weren't much flatter for Kumble, and the 'away' (for you) pitches were a lot better for fast bowling when Ashwin/Jadeja played than they were for Kumble.
You shouldn't pretend like this isn't an agenda either though. Makes you even more dishonest when you cite such threads in other discussions.
subshakerz
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Hone and away pitches in Kumbles 2000 time were flatter for everyone
Thala_0710
International Captain
Not really away, spinners avged 38.3 in SENA in 2000s....they avged 42.5 there in the 2010s