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*Unofficial* New Zealand Black Caps Thread
- Thread starter NZTailender
- Start date
The Hutt Rec
International Vice-Captain
Andrew Jones all the way ... a bit CD, but played for us in his glory years.
I was a poor Dunedin uni student for that 2004 England tour (but sacrificed it all to pay for sky for our flat) and watched almost every ball of that test series ... McCullum really deserved that 100 at Lords.
I was a poor Dunedin uni student for that 2004 England tour (but sacrificed it all to pay for sky for our flat) and watched almost every ball of that test series ... McCullum really deserved that 100 at Lords.
Kippax
Cricketer Of The Year
Yeah the idea was obviously to have someone with a bit of post-globalism glamour and huge name recognition for the sons of rich dentists and doctors who pay the lion's share of the bills for these centres. You two are conceding to the visitor "in the seriously global and professional era, these centres haven't produced anyone".
The Hutt Rec
International Vice-Captain
We’ll never fix it if we don’t embrace it.
NZTailender
I can't believe I ate the whole thing
So with England touring in November and their poor Ashes, reckon it'll be a clean 2-0 for us? England generally are good at bouncing back and can be unpredictable sometimes (Sri Lanka 3-0), but too short a turn around to work out their problems?
I think we're due a tour there in 2022, by which time they'll have fully turned things round you'd expect.
I think we're due a tour there in 2022, by which time they'll have fully turned things round you'd expect.
RossTaylorsBox
Cricket Web: All-Time Legend
Aren't they going to rest a whole bunch of players (read: getting the excuses in early)?
Fuller Pilch
Hall of Fame Member
Apparently they've reversed that after not winning the Ashes and will pick a decent team.
The techniques they're carrying, if they get on a green one there's going to be chaos. It's one of the worst techniqued top orders I can recall. Mind you if it's flat, there's enough firepower to make us hurt. And even if it was green, their red hot bowling attack would pick our carcass.
Bahnz
Hall of Fame Member
If England can get Anderson, Broad and Archer on the park at the same time they'll still be a nasty prospect. There will definitely be a clean out of the ODI WC riff-raff from the test team, and I reckon that the rest that Joe Root will get over the next couple months will help him out.
Our batting looks solid though, and the bowling is obviously in good shape. Will tentatively say 1-1 if Anderson tours and 2-0 to NZ if not.
Our batting looks solid though, and the bowling is obviously in good shape. Will tentatively say 1-1 if Anderson tours and 2-0 to NZ if not.
Yeah you're right, I'm defaulting to pessimism but I really shouldn't. The only concern really in the top 7 is Raval, who honestly I think we can lock in for an average of >10 - especially if there's some spice in the wicket. But Latham has form, Williamson and Taylor we know are world class, and we have two guys in Watling and Nicholls who we know will never be mentally beaten, plus Colin who is hitting them well recently. Jeepers, even Southee has a bit of lower order form.
Fuller Pilch
Hall of Fame Member
I wouldn’t be surprised if there is a majorly rain-affected draw with tests late Nov-early Dec. I’ll go 1-0 to NZ.
Bahnz
Hall of Fame Member
Which is why Latham averaged 36 when England last toured NZ, and Raval averaged 8.
This is blatantly not true. What could you possibly be basing it on?
Bahnz
Hall of Fame Member
Raval's 2016/17 purple patch.
jcas0167
International Debutant
Too close to call. The English bowling attack is potentially very strong. The likes of Burns, Root & Stokes shouldn't be fazed by early season NZ conditions.
Moss
International Vice-Captain
Glad there's a good break before the England series and the rest of the summer, the players really need to put their feet up following a pretty emotionally draining world cup and a short but intense Sri Lanka tour after that.
Though I think someone like Raval might have have benefited from appearing in the final round of the county championship given he gets a lot less international cricket than the others. I tend to agree with Flem that he's better against quick bowling than Latham, but IMO the long breaks between NZ's test series in the last 2 years haven't helped him. As I recall he didn't have a great time of it with Yorkshire last year and that could be why he hasn't been signed up this time around,
Though I think someone like Raval might have have benefited from appearing in the final round of the county championship given he gets a lot less international cricket than the others. I tend to agree with Flem that he's better against quick bowling than Latham, but IMO the long breaks between NZ's test series in the last 2 years haven't helped him. As I recall he didn't have a great time of it with Yorkshire last year and that could be why he hasn't been signed up this time around,
Before bowlers worked out that if you operate in the channel to Raval going across him and never get straight, he can't hurt you. Hasn't done too much since then other than the Bangladesh ton.
Flem274*
123/5
raval has 560 runs @ 35 against south africa, england and pakistan
while he does average 8 against england, he averages 64 against south africa and 31 against pakistan. granted, he has not yet played against australia.
tom latham averages 27 with 808 runs against those same sides. 36 against england, 31 against pakistan and a whopping 11 against south africa
if you add in australia and india, who raval has not yet played so i didn't include them until now because it wouldn't be fair on latham, his record stays about the same. 1330 runs at 28.
up until the most recent test match tom latham was pretty worthless at his primary role - opening the batting against pace attacks in pace friendly conditions.
raval averages 42 in nz against the good pace attacks he's faced, latham 24.
if you want to use simon doull memes, in nz raval has faced more balls than latham from 3 less tests against these teams, which means he's doing a better job of blunting the new ball.
latham is a far superior player of spin and imo would make an excellent #5, but we're not comparing #5 batsmen here.
Bahnz
Hall of Fame Member
Flem, we all know you think that Latham scoring 264 against a Sri Lanka team that went on to role SA twice doesn't count because reasons, but even if you set that aside, at the end of the day, there's no strong basis for saying Raval is a better player of quick bowling.
Against Pakistan both players average 31, against WI both average low 40's, against England Latham holds the advantage, and against SA Raval does. Your entire argument is built on a solitary test series (SA's tour in 2017). Raval has never toured any of the fast bowling dominant countries (Aus, England, SA, WI), and has played neither of the two best fast bowling attacks in the world currently, so please spare us about how obviously clearly superior he is against pace.
Against Pakistan both players average 31, against WI both average low 40's, against England Latham holds the advantage, and against SA Raval does. Your entire argument is built on a solitary test series (SA's tour in 2017). Raval has never toured any of the fast bowling dominant countries (Aus, England, SA, WI), and has played neither of the two best fast bowling attacks in the world currently, so please spare us about how obviously clearly superior he is against pace.