Would Jimmy Anderson make Australia's full strength side?

[Athlai]

The OP just asked if he would make the side, he didn't specify against whom or where.

Appologies if Im coming accross as going off my nut, Im not but i guess thats the limitations of this form of comunication.......i can see how it may appear like that.

MW nailed it as "frustration".......frustration because the OP has a history of not recognising or crediting anything outside of Australia. This is a dire thread and the timing of it is rank. Stephen can dress it up however he likes and talk about meanigful discussion but it's all bull****.

The whole subtext is along the lines of your Greatest Pommy bowler with 500 test poles wouldnt even make our current 11 if they were all fit and firing.

Could he? Sure. Would he? He'd probably have been dropped off and on.

 

[TheJediBrah]

If Anderson was South African would he even have 100 Test wickets?

 

[stephen]

Is the sample size for these players even appropriate to be able to make a proper assessment? Cummins has played 5 tests, Bird has played 8 and Pattinson has played 17 but he hasn't bowled in a test match for almost 2 years. At best, the majority of these players are unknowns, so I am not sure why they should be considered over someone with 500+ test wickets.

As far as Hazlewood is concerned, I would pick Anderson over him basically anywhere else in the world except perhaps Australia. Even in Australia, I think it would be a close call because I think Hazlewood's stats benefit from bowling against touring sides with little experience in Australian conditions (much like Anderson's do in England).

That was part of the question. Undoubtedly Anderson has been a top bowler at home and a decent bowler away for a while now, but would he be picked if he was an Australian? I see him a lot like Sayers in that even though he takes a crapton of wickets, Australian selectors may look past that to the speed gun.

Honestly Hazlewood is the best fast bowler Australia have had since Harris retired. Starc is overrated. Pattinson and Cummins both have so much potential that if they get decent runs I could see both taking 300+ wickets at under 25.

So I definitely don't think that it's a clear cut thing. Australian selectors would first-pick Starc due to his raw talent and variety. I could then see them taking Hazlewood over Anderson due to his versatility. Which would leave the third seamer. I could see selectors taking Cummins as a strike option for the third bowler, leaving Anderson out.

I am sorry about the timing on this, I hadn't actually read the cricketing news (wasn't following the England/West Indies series at all). If I'd realised before I made this poll that Anderson had both cracked the 500 and number 1 slot I'd have waited until closer to the Ashes. Which is where my head was at in asking the question. It is, after all, the only test match series that truly matters.

So if anyone wants to be offended by this, take it as an early Ashes sledge.

 

[Athlai]

Andre Nel managed it and James Anderson is waaaaaay better than him even before he got properly good. Having Anderson would've really rounded out South Africa's attack from 2006 till now. They always had 2 genuine guns but rarely had an attack of 4 genuine wicket takers.

 

[stephen]

Pretty disrespectful of Jimmy to suggest he wouldn't be picked ahead of guys who have played less than 10 Tests, but the funny kind of disrespectful

Stephen is known for having a massive hard-on for all Aussie quicks (including Bird) though

This generation of Aussie quicks is genuinely exciting. In the McGrath era I didn't rate most of his fast bowling support act very highly. Bichel was awesome but only because he was a Queenslander and a top bloke. I never rated Dizzy quite as highly as most. Brett Lee was a useless spud and Kasper was a decent support bowler but nothing special.

Since then we've had best in the world/worst in the world Johnson, Harris the great and now the current generation. Of those guys Bird is the most unlucky since he'll almost certainly never get a decent run in the side.

I certainly don't think our batting stocks are that great, Smith and Warner aside but we have 4 potential ATG fast bowlers right now. The frustrating thing is that they're always injured (Haze aside). Pattinson is a truly scary beast and I actually rate him the highest of the lot, despite the fact that he's a Victorian and the least likely to make the side.

 

[Starfighter]

Starc is overrated.

Yay! Good to see someone else with this opinion.

 

[stephen]

Andre Nel managed it and James Anderson is waaaaaay better than him even before he got properly good. Having Anderson would've really rounded out South Africa's attack from 2006 till now. They always had 2 genuine guns but rarely had an attack of 4 genuine wicket takers.

He's definitely better than Morkel, who I don't rate at all. He's behind Steyn and Philander and I think Rabada would have favored for quota reasons. Rabada now would be ahead due to ability, but Anderson would still be good enough while Steyn is injured.

 

[stephen]

Yay! Good to see someone else with this opinion.

While it would never happen I'd love to see him behind Pattinson, Hazlewood and Cummins in the pecking order. That'd allow him to focus more on his white ball game which is his strength (and Pattinson and Cummins are really not good white ball bowlers at all).

 

[Spark]

The OP just asked if he would make the side, he didn't specify against whom or where.

Appologies if Im coming accross as going off my nut, Im not but i guess thats the limitations of this form of comunication.......i can see how it may appear like that.

MW nailed it as "frustration".......frustration because the OP has a history of not recognising or crediting anything outside of Australia. This is a dire thread and the timing of it is rank. Stephen can dress it up however he likes and talk about meanigful discussion but it's all bull****.

The whole subtext is along the lines of your Greatest Pommy bowler with 500 test poles wouldnt even make our current 11 if they were all fit and firing.

Yeah, but when you're talking about picking a bowler for Australia, the most important consideration is how they'll do in those conditions given that at least half of your Tests - and moreover, the Tests that will be more scrutinised - will be in those conditions.

Let's put it another way. Taking his career trajectory, how many wickets do you think a Mitchell Johnson would have taken for England?

 

[TheJediBrah]

Yay! Good to see someone else with this opinion.

I've always thought that too, especially in red-ball cricket.

 

[Athlai]

Yeah, but when you're talking about picking a bowler for Australia, the most important consideration is how they'll do in those conditions given that at least half of your Tests - and moreover, the Tests that will be more scrutinised - will be in those conditions.

Let's put it another way. Taking his career trajectory, how many wickets do you think a Mitchell Johnson would have taken for England?

Probably more

 

[mr_mister]

hell yeah more. we served him roads to bowl on his whole career. in hindsight i was too harsh a critic on ol' Mitch

 

[stephen]

Johnson ended with career stats better than I thought they'd be.

I can't see his style being effective long term in England though. The wickets over there don't reward bang-it-in type bowlers, they suit slower, more controlled swing/seam bowlers.

 

[morgieb]

Johnson ended with career stats better than I thought they'd be.

I can't see his style being effective long term in England though. The wickets over there don't reward bang-it-in type bowlers, they suit slower, more controlled swing/seam bowlers.

Yeah, the place where Johnson would've been a really nasty mother****er would've been South Africa. Especially with Steyn as his partner in crime.

 

[stephen]

Yeah, the place where Johnson would've been a really nasty mother****er would've been South Africa. Especially with Steyn as his partner in crime.

If that had have happened I'm sure there would have been a number of batting retirements which coincided with scheduled tours of South Africa. Having Steyn would have helped Johnson because he hated leading the attack.

 

[TheJediBrah]

Steyn and Johnson as a team would have been pretty much the same as Harris and Johnson as a team except for a much longer period


I can imagine Johnson on song really ****ing with guys like Michael Clarke and Brad Haddin

 

[stephen]

I wish the West Indies would produce another ATG test bowler and start producing more bowler friendly pitches like the ones in the 80s/90s. The current crop of pitches might as well be Asian.

Really the only place for swing bowlers in the world now is England. South Africa/Australia reward seam bowling and Asia rewards spin.

 

[TheJediBrah]

I wish the West Indies would produce another ATG test bowler and start producing more bowler friendly pitches like the ones in the 80s/90s. The current crop of pitches might as well be Asian.

Really the only place for swing bowlers in the world now is England. South Africa/Australia reward seam bowling and Asia rewards spin.

Day/night tests could help swing bowling. At least in the night sessions.

 

[Groundking]

Rabada?

Looking at Anderson since the 2013 home Ashes series he's played 30 home tests and 17 away/neutral tests. Combining his away and neutral stats over that time he averages just a tick under 30. At home he's averaging 20 in the same time period. His tours to Australia, India and South Africa he averaged over 43.

I think it's fair to say that like Ashwin/Jadeja he's an ATG at home and first pick in those conditions. But just like it's fair to ask if you'd pick a different spinner outside Asia, it's fair to ask whether you'd pick a different quick outside England.

Yeah and the dude was either injured or coming back from injury for all those tours, he's not the best at coming back from injury and those places are brutal to come back and try and get in form again at.

I wish the West Indies would produce another ATG test bowler and start producing more bowler friendly pitches like the ones in the 80s/90s. The current crop of pitches might as well be Asian.

Really the only place for swing bowlers in the world now is England. South Africa/Australia reward seam bowling and Asia rewards spin.

New Zealand?

 

[Dan]

Man I'm looking forward to seeing Cummins on Australian decks. I think he'll be our standout bowler this summer if he's fit.

His performance on the Indian and Bangladeshi wickets this winter has been phenomenal.

If he gets his wrist position right he's going to be ****ing immense.