**Official** Australian Domestic Season 2013/14

[Prince EWS]

I was encouraged last season when he did produce a string of decent scores and when he started opening in the big bash I felt he had a bit to work with, you know develop some more

Didn't that basically just happen because all the bowlers in their infinite wisdom decided to repeatedly bowl short to him despite his whole setup being based around that?

I'd be highly surprised if that ever happened again.

[Dan]

Haha, I made a few jokes about how the management should consider Watlinging him but I don't think he's in any way keen on it. He did keep a bit in junior cricket but I don't think he's ever been a full-time wicket keeper for any serious cricket side before.

Yeah, I understand it wasn't fully serious, but tbh he's a gun ODI top-order bat, none of our 'keepers do anything unless they open (and we've got way too many opening options as it is), and it lets us play a better batsman than the 'keeper would be. If he were keen for it, I reckon it would genuinely improve the ODI side.

[adub]

for any serious cricket side before.

He plays for South Australia now so no change there

[Top_Cat]

Ryan Carters.

I know he's better with the bat but is he any better with the mitts?

[Spikey]

remember Tom Triffitt

Yeah, can't see anyone challenging Ludeman. He has Berry good support within the SACA setup.

i cant believe you decided to go ahead with that

[Prince EWS]

Yeah, I understand it wasn't fully serious, but tbh he's a gun ODI top-order bat, none of our 'keepers do anything unless they open (and we've got way too many opening options as it is), and it lets us play a better batsman than the 'keeper would be. If he were keen for it, I reckon it would genuinely improve the ODI side.

Funnily enough, I kind of think the exact opposite about the ODI side. With Watson and Faulkner in the side it pretty much automatically gives you batting down to eight with still maintaining five frontline ODI bowlers. I think it affords the side the luxury of picking the best gloveman in the country without worrying too much about the batting, as he could bat eight without any dramas to the balance of the side.

Where it gets confusing from that point is that the wicket keepers in the "best glovemen in the country but poor OD batsmen" category - Paine, Nevill, Hartley - all have very correct techniques and find it hard to improvise at times. At eight they'd be really out of place. It'd be fine if they were just hacks with the bat, but they're not.

Which leaves me basically just picking Haddin and hoping things get simpler by the time he's done.

[Spikey]

guys just pick a specialist keeper for the T20 and ODI team

[Top_Cat]

remember Tom Triffitt



i cant believe you decided to go ahead with that

Chuck would love it because someone said his name.

[Dan]

Funnily enough, I kind of think the exact opposite about the ODI side. With Watson and Faulkner in the side it pretty much automatically gives you batting down to eight with still maintaining five frontline ODI bowlers. I think it affords the side the luxury of picking the best gloveman in the country without worrying too much about the batting, as he could bat eight without any dramas to the balance of the side.

Where it gets confusing from that point is that the wicket keepers in the "best glovemen in the country but poor OD batsmen" category - Paine, Nevill, Hartley - all have very correct techniques and find it hard to improvise at times. At eight they'd be really out of place. It'd be fine if they were just hacks with the bat, but they're not.

Which leaves me basically just picking Haddin and hoping things get simpler by the time he's done.

Yeah, my original argument was going to be an all-rounder at 7, in case one of the frontliners shunts it (let's face it, one of them usually does). Then I realised that, when Clarke isn't playing and Smitteh takes his rightful place in the ODI side, I'd be NSW-ing the team:

Finch/Warner, Watson, Hughes +, Bailey*, Smith, Voges, Maxwell, Faulkner, Johnson, McKay, Doherty

Honestly, if Hughes works at it I can't see him being significantly inferior with the gloves to whoever is picked to replace Haddin (since it won't be one of the good-gloveman-but-poor-OD-batsman group; they'll probably go for Wade again), and it lets you keep Voges in the side for a bit longer. Arguably you could bring in Paine for Finch/Warner and keep the rest of the XI I've suggested there as-is, but apart from doing that I think Hughes with the gloves keeps the overall side stronger.

With your 'bat them at 8' suggestion, does NUFAN's boi Ludeman qualify as enough of a hack with the bat to find a way to improvise? What's Carters' glovework like?

[NUFAN]

Yeah, I understand it wasn't fully serious, but tbh he's a gun ODI top-order bat, none of our 'keepers do anything unless they open (and we've got way too many opening options as it is), and it lets us play a better batsman than the 'keeper would be. If he were keen for it, I reckon it would genuinely improve the ODI side.

I made the same revelation during the ODI series and believe it is worth a shot.

Funnily enough, I kind of think the exact opposite about the ODI side. With Watson and Faulkner in the side it pretty much automatically gives you batting down to eight with still maintaining five frontline ODI bowlers. I think it affords the side the luxury of picking the best gloveman in the country without worrying too much about the batting, as he could bat eight without any dramas to the balance of the side.

Where it gets confusing from that point is that the wicket keepers in the "best glovemen in the country but poor OD batsmen" category - Paine, Nevill, Hartley - all have very correct techniques and find it hard to improvise at times. At eight they'd be really out of place. It'd be fine if they were just hacks with the bat, but they're not.

Which leaves me basically just picking Haddin and hoping things get simpler by the time he's done.

Beefy Boi wants Ludeman in the ODI team!

[NUFAN]

Sam Whiteman is the kid that is going places btw.

[Spikey]

Finch/Warner, Watson, Hughes +, Bailey*, Smith, Voges, Maxwell, Faulkner, Johnson, McKay, Doherty

lol faulkner and mckay over starc

[Dan]

Ran that off the India ODIs, tbh. Given the discussion is about batting and wicketkeeping I wasn't all that concerned by which placeholder bowlers I selected.

Starc walks into that side, yeah.

[Spikey]

put a fork into faulkner

[Prince EWS]

With your 'bat them at 8' suggestion, does NUFAN's boi Ludeman qualify as enough of a hack with the bat to find a way to improvise?

Oh he's definitely a hack; he's just an entirely unsuccessful hack. I think Hartley, Paine, Nev etc would make better #8s than him anyway, as long as the opposition actually knew how to bowl in the batsman's half.

I think the best fit for the spot if I was going to really follow through on my thoughts on it would be Tim Paine. Pre-injury he was actually quite a good OD player - better with the gloves than Haddin is now and actually had success batting through the innings (ironically) as a top order playing, having an average in the mid 30s (which has dropped a bit now) and five tons (one of which was in an ODI). As I said before he's not really suited to the finisher's role as he's a correct player and not a big hitter, although he definitely did develop some ramps and glides as a T20 cricketer. What's really holding me back from putting my balls on the line and advocating one of CricketWeb's most mocked players for the job is that I haven't really seen him play much since that bad injury - he hasn't scored any runs since then and he may not be keeping as well either. If he's not a better keeper than Haddin then it makes it all entirely pointless. Don't want to derail the thread too much from the all-important discussion of NSW's Sheffield Shield campaign, but I think I'd be working towards an ODI side looking like this if Paine could give me what I wanted (ie. improvisation with the bat and tidy keeping) though:

1. Watson
2. Hughes
3. Clarke
4. Bailey
5. Smith
6. Maxwell/Voges
7. Faulkner
8. Paine
9. Starc
10. McKay/Johnson
11. Spinner/Johnson

Happy enough to take Haddin through to the World Cup as long as he keeps decently though. I really do think his time of being worth much with the bat in ODI cricket is over but he's still the most suited to being a finisher if he can ensure his glovework doesn't slip.