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Thread: CW All Time Country XI Discussion Thread

  1. #31
    International Vice-Captain watson's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Slifer View Post
    Me thinks it depends on whom each team is playing and where

    Vs Eng home and away I think either attack would cause damage
    Vs RSA ditto but i think Oz would have the edge with the spinners
    vs Pakistan again either attack would be effective but again Oz's spinners woud edge it
    vs India well home or away (IMO) Oz's spinnners would get slaughtered. WI i think would be more effective in India. No comment on what they would do to India at home
    vs NZ Advantage Oz with the spinners
    vs SL this is where I think Oz's advantage would be most pronounced. With the exception of MM and maybe Mcgrath, I can see either pace bowling attack being seriously dented in SL but Warne and Oreilly I'd expect to wreak havok on SL wickets.
    vs each other In Oz on ur typical Sydney wicket the spinners would probably be a handful and the bigger Oz grounds would make it difficult for Viv and co to hit them out of the park. Vs the pacemen I can see the WI lineup holding their own for the simple fact that almost all the WI batsmen would have faced these bowlers and had varying degrees of success. The WI pacemen all have exceptional records in Oz. Amby in particular did wonders vs excellent Oz batting lineups so there's no reason to think that the 4 prong wouldnt atleast break even vs the Oz batting lineup. And I expect them to pulverise Oz at the Waca. Back in the WI well tbh, the spinners would be minced. CAribbean grounds are smaller and the wickets not at all conduscive to spin. That would effectively reduce Oz to a 3 man attack and we all know how WI batsmen are on their own patch. In the WI advantage WI attack
    However, there are still rays of hope. Stuart MacGill's 24 wickets at 19 runs a piece during his 1999 tour of the West Indies springs to mind.
    Last edited by watson; 26-05-2013 at 02:10 AM.

  2. #32
    Cricket Web: All-Time Legend smalishah84's Avatar
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    In the end I think if an AT World XI test championship was to be held the final would be played out between the WI and Aus and IMO it would be mighty close.

    On flatter wickets I would give the edge to the WI (due to their bowlers having a proven record in such conditions) but on pace friendly wickets I reckon that the Aussies might take it but it could go either way. I do know that while Viv is arguably the greatest player of pace bowling ever there is also the thing that he was somewhat temperamental. The WI cricketers have historically had this flamboyance about them that has been their strength while at the same time has been to their detriment a few times as well. Also on a spinner's paradise I can see the WI struggling to answer Warne or Reilly while WI wouldn't have anyone to match that skill. Coming to Australia, historically speaking (and not counting the brain farts of Brad Haddin and his ilk), they have been far and away the most gritty team to have played cricket. Fiercely competitive and always fighting to the last man. You feel like punching the living daylights out of their batsmen for getting stuck at the crease but there has always been (at least here in Pakistan) a grudging admiration of their tenacity and their mental toughness. It is this quality of theirs (and it is extremely debatable of course) that I feel would eventually take them to win a closely fought championship series against the WI.
    Last edited by smalishah84; 26-05-2013 at 03:31 AM.
    And smalishah's avatar is the most classy one by far Jan certainly echoes the sentiments of CW

    Yeah we don't crap in the first world; most of us would actually have no idea what that was emanating from Ajmal's backside. Why isn't it roses and rainbows like what happens here? PEWS's retort to Ganeshran on Daemon's picture depicting Ajmal's excreta

  3. #33
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    Could we sim matches between these sides?
    ATG World XI
    1. J.B Hobbs 2. H. Sutcliffe 3. D.G Bradman 4. W.R Hammond 5. G.S Sobers 6. M.J Procter 7. A.C Gilchrist 8. M.D Marshall 9. S.K Warne 10. M. Muralitharan 11. G.D McGrath

  4. #34
    Cricket Web: All-Time Legend smalishah84's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Slifer View Post
    Me thinks it depends on whom each team is playing and where

    Vs Eng home and away I think either attack would cause damage
    Vs RSA ditto but i think Oz would have the edge with the spinners
    vs Pakistan again either attack would be effective but again Oz's spinners woud edge it
    I think you haven't seen Miandad, Salim Malik, and Javed Miandad play spin. I am pretty sure they wouldn't struggle that much against Shane Warne and Co. In fact in Pakistan I will give the WI attack the edge.


  5. #35
    Cricket Web: All-Time Legend smalishah84's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by kyear2 View Post
    Cricketweb Australia All Time XI
    Victor Trumper
    Arthur Morris
    Sir Donald Bradman *
    Greg Chappell
    Allan Border
    Keith Miller
    Adam Gilchrist +
    Shane Warne
    Denis Lillee
    Bill O'Reilly
    Glenn McGrath

    Ricky Ponting
    Allan Davidson

    Cricketweb West Indies All Time XI
    Gordon Greenidge
    Sir Conrad Hunte
    George Headley *
    Sir I.V.A. Richards
    Brian Lara
    Sir Garfield Sobers
    Sir Clyde Walcott +
    Malcolm Marshall
    Michael Holding
    Curtly Ambrose
    Joel Garner

    Frank Worrell
    Lance Gibbs

    Cricketweb England All Time XI
    Sir Jack Hobbs
    Sir Len Hutton *
    Wally Hammond
    Ken Barrington
    Denis Compton
    Sir Ian Botham
    Allan Knott +
    Jim Laker
    Harold Larwood
    Fred Trueman
    Syd Barnes

    Hedley Verity
    Kevin Pietersen

    Cricketweb South Africa All Time XI
    Barry Richards
    Graeme Smith *
    Jacques Kallis
    Graeme Pollock
    Dudley Nourse
    Aubrey Faulkner
    Mike Procter
    John Waite +
    Dale Steyn
    Hugh Tayfield
    Allan Donald

    Shaun Pollock
    Herbie Taylor

    Cricketweb Pakistan All Time XI
    Hanif Mohammad
    Saeed Anwar
    Younis Khan
    Javed Miandad
    Inzamam-ul-Haq
    Mushtaq Mohammad
    Imran Khan *
    Rashid Latif +
    Wasim Akram
    Fazal Mahmood
    Waqar Younis

    Mohammad Yousuf
    Saqlain Mushtaq

    Cricketweb India All Time XI
    Sunil Gavaskar
    Vijay Merchant
    Rahul Dravid
    Sachin Tendulkar
    Vijay Hazare
    Vinoo Mankad
    Farokh Engineer
    Kapil Dev
    Anil Kumble
    Javagal Srinath
    Erapalli Prasanna

    Mohammad Azharuddin
    Amar Singh

    Cricketweb Sri Lankan All Time XI
    Marvan Atapattu
    Sanath Jayasuriya
    Kumar Sangakkara
    Aravinda de Silva
    Mahela Jayawardene *
    Thilan Samaraweera
    Prasanna Jayawardene +
    Chaminda Vaas
    Lasith Malinga
    Muttiah Muralitharan
    Rangana Herath

    Arjuna Ranatunga
    Ashantha de Mel

    Cricketweb New Zealand All Time XI
    Glenn Turner
    Stewie Dempster
    Bert Sutcliffe
    Martin Crowe
    Martin Donnelly
    Brendon McCullum +
    John R. Reid
    Chris Cairns
    Sir Richard Hadlee
    Shane Bond
    Jack Cowie

    Stephen Fleming
    Hedley Howarth
    Am I the only one who feels that the Pakistan can beat the English ATXI?

  6. #36
    International Vice-Captain Monk's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by smalishah84 View Post
    Am I the only one who feels that the Pakistan can beat the English ATXI?
    That Pakistan team is capable of smashing anyone. Wasim, Waqar, Fazal and Imran form one hell of a pace attack.

  7. #37
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    Quote Originally Posted by smalishah84 View Post
    Am I the only one who feels that the Pakistan can beat the English ATXI?
    Sorry man, batting doesn't stack up. Two of the best 3 openers of all time? (nobody will convince me Hutton>Sutcliffe) Hammond, possibly the 2nd best #3 ever? Not to mention Barrington and Compton.. Add in Barnes, Larwood and Laker, along with possibly the best man to throw on a pair of gloves, and its an English victory imo. Plus its not like Pakistan will catch any of them...
    Last edited by Coronis; 26-05-2013 at 03:53 AM.

  8. #38
    International Vice-Captain Monk's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Coronis View Post
    Sorry man, batting doesn't stack up. Two of the best 3 openers of all time? (nobody will convince me Hutton>Sutcliffe) Hammond, possibly the 2nd best #3 ever? Not to mention Barrington and Compton.. Add in Barnes, Larwood and Laker, along with possibly the best man to throw on a pair of gloves, and its an English victory imo. Plus its not like Pakistan will catch any of them...
    I'd back that Pakistan pace attack to dismiss a few teams for under 200.

  9. #39
    Cricket Web: All-Time Legend smalishah84's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Coronis View Post
    Sorry man, batting doesn't stack up. Two of the best 3 openers of all time? (nobody will convince me Hutton>Sutcliffe) Hammond, possibly the 2nd best #3 ever? Not to mention Barrington and Compton.. Add in Barnes, Larwood and Laker, along with possibly the best man to throw on a pair of gloves, and its an English victory imo. Plus its not like Pakistan will catch any of them...
    In flat conditions I would back Imran, Wasim and Waqar to start reversing the crap out of Triple H (hobbs hammond and hutton)......and Latif was no mean slouch with the gloves either. Knott doesn't have gilchrist-ish batting skills so I don't see a huge edge. And Laker was good but he wasn't all that.

    In swinging conditions though it might be another story

  10. #40
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    Quote Originally Posted by kyear2 View Post
    as the two spinners is a bit of over kill and hasn'nt been proven effectiive outside of the sub continent since the advent of covered pitches and Miller in the top 6 in an ATG context is a liability.
    Not so sure about that. O'Reilly and Grimmett played in an era when pitches weren't covered but were generally high quality in preparation. They succeeded well enough on those pitches and didn't need rain to be effective. Since them there's been Laker and Lock and McGill and Warne. Not many its true but I think the real reason for the dearth of double spin attacks is down to the fact that its rare any country having 2 top notch spinners at anyone time rather than the breed being ineffective in pairs.

  11. #41
    International Regular kyear2's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by smalishah84 View Post
    Am I the only one who feels that the Pakistan can beat the English ATXI?
    No, they very much can. Think that with that bowling attack they are capable of beating anyone even though their batting isn't up to the level of some of the other teams. Those four fast bowlers can bowl out any team. Really any of the top five teams could sping a surprise, W.I., Aus, S.A., Eng, Pak.
    Last edited by kyear2; 26-05-2013 at 06:21 AM.
    Aus. XI
    Simpson^ | Hayden | Bradman | Chappell^ | Ponting | Border* | Gilchrist+ | Davidson3 | Warne4^ | Lillee1 | McGrath2


    W.I. XI
    Greenidge | Hunte | Richards^ | Headley* | Lara^ | Sobers5^ | Walcott+ | Marshall1 | Ambrose2 | Holding3 | Garner4

    S.A. XI
    Richards^ | Smith*^ | Amla | Pollock | Kallis5^ | Nourse | Waite+ | Procter3 | Steyn1 | Tayfield4 | Donald2

    Eng. XI
    Hobbs | Hutton*^ | Hammond^ | Compton | Barrington | Botham5^ | Knott | Trueman1 | Laker4 | Larwood2 | Barnes3

  12. #42
    International Regular kyear2's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by the big bambino View Post
    Not so sure about that. O'Reilly and Grimmett played in an era when pitches weren't covered but were generally high quality in preparation. They succeeded well enough on those pitches and didn't need rain to be effective. Since them there's been Laker and Lock and McGill and Warne. Not many its true but I think the real reason for the dearth of double spin attacks is down to the fact that its rare any country having 2 top notch spinners at anyone time rather than the breed being ineffective in pairs.
    I think that in the modern game the match winners has been not exclusively, but primarily the fast bolwers. Even when Australia had Warne and Macgill they only played them together on extremely spin friendly conditions and Macgill was very good. The just preferred for the most part to play three seamers.

  13. #43
    International 12th Man Slifer's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by kyear2 View Post
    no, they very much can. Think that with that bowling attack they are capable of beating anyone even though their batting isn't up to the level of some of the other teams. Those four fast bowlers can bowl out any team. really any of the top five teams could sping a surprise, w.i., aus, s.a., eng, pak.
    awta.
    Cause Slifer said so.........!!!!

  14. #44
    International Regular kyear2's Avatar
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    That being said though, would still place my money on a West Indies vs Australia final. Just too much quality in those two lineups. 10 out of the 11 players on each team makes one of my top four ATG XIs with most of them making the top two teams. Impressive.

  15. #45
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    Quote Originally Posted by kyear2 View Post
    I think that in the modern game the match winners has been not exclusively, but primarily the fast bolwers. Even when Australia had Warne and Macgill they only played them together on extremely spin friendly conditions and Macgill was very good. The just preferred for the most part to play three seamers.
    That's true though I'm not sure about saving them for spinning wkts as both (Warne and McGill) had good records on all pitches. I recall going through the records when the 2 played together and it was pretty impressive. Not as good as Scarlett and Tiger but not shabby in comparison. So I think they could have worked well together but you are right to say we preferred the 3rd seamer. Either way I have a suspicion that Ian Chappell prefers a 3/2 attack biased to seam. If you can get 2 all rounders in that lot then its worthwhile playing.

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