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Shivnarine Chanderpaul vs Martin Crowe

Who is the better test batsman?

  • Total voters
    38
Slifer

Slifer

International Captain
Chanderpaul amongst west Indians is behind the following:

Viv
Gary
Lara
Headley
Walcott
Lloyd
Worrell
Weekes
Kanhai
Greenidge
Hunte
Then Chanders
 
Silver Silva

Silver Silva

International Vice-Captain
slowfinger said:
why does Chanderpaul's insane batting stats get almost no recognition in ATG discussions? Is it because he was a FTB?
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Not really he actually struggled only in Zimbabwe , Pakistan, UAE and Australia ..Everywhere else he averaged 37 and above . Only team he averaged under 40 against was Zimbabwe .
 
Coronis

Coronis

Cricket Web: All-Time Legend
Yeah I think Chanderpaul gets overhated a bit here - I’d take Crowe over him tho.

Just looking at his stats when his career overlapped with Lara and afterwards

(1994-2006)
173 innings 22 n.o’s 6736 runs @ 44.6 14 tons

(aged 32 at that point)

(2006-2015)
107 innings 27 n.o’s 5131 runs @ 64.13 16 tons

Obviously it was very difficult to carry such a **** team for so long, but he made the best of it. He gets criticized for being selfish and batting for his average but I don’t blame him, when you’re the lone quality player on a bad team isn’t that what most people usually do? I didn’t follow his career closely enough to see if he actually was costing the Windies any wins by batting poorly with the tail to protect himself - obviously if he did this is a huge negative.

Perhaps he should’ve moved up the order but hey some people are great just where they are, I don’t see anyone saying Border should’ve.

Impressive in general what he was able to do from that age onwards.

His average does flatter him of course - we all know that - he probably doesn’t get the love he deserves due to his slow scoring rate and having to follow Lara.
 
Prince EWS

Prince EWS

Global Moderator
Coronis said:
What I mean is, if the team has no chance of winning the game, wouldn’t you then be playing for yourself and your own stats?
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Chanders did it a lot even when the game was still live though.

I think the criticisms of Waugh, Kallis etc doing this are way overblown and I basically just ignore them, but it was actually quite visibly true with Chanders. The worst thing about it was his refusal to go up the order. If you're crap at accelerating or farming the strike with the tail you should at least be open to batting in the top four to see if that works.
 
Coronis

Coronis

Cricket Web: All-Time Legend
Prince EWS said:
Chanders did it a lot even when the game was still live though.

I think the criticisms of Waugh, Kallis etc doing this are way overblown and I basically just ignore them, but it was actually quite visibly true with Chanders. The worst thing about it was his refusal to go up the order. If you're crap at accelerating or farming the strike with the tail you should at least be open to batting in the top four to see if that works.
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Well like I said, I didn’t follow his career that closely (who would follow West Indian test cricket lately). If he was actively playing selfishly in games where wins were still possible then yeah that is **** of him.

Do you think Border should have moved up the order too?
 
P

PlayerComparisons

International Captain
Coronis said:
What I mean is, if the team has no chance of winning the game, wouldn’t you then be playing for yourself and your own stats?
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Chanderpaul decided to hide down the order and red ink before the games even started lol. Most players in weak teams still play for the team.
 
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Prince EWS

Prince EWS

Global Moderator
Coronis said:
Well like I said, I didn’t follow his career that closely (who would follow West Indian test cricket lately). If he was actively playing selfishly in games where wins were still possible then yeah that is **** of him.

Do you think Border should have moved up the order too?
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I'm too young to actually remember Border's career so I don't know how good he was at batting with the tail, but either way he actually batted at four more than any other position.

I don't necessarily think that if you're good you should bat higher, but if you're good and you suck at batting with the tail and keep just finishing on 70* then you should at least give it up higher up and see if it works.

Fielding captains openly just gave Chanderpaul a single and focused on getting everyone else out. Chanders got his red ink and his opposition got their 240 all out - everyone was happy but it sucked for the team.

(still better than Crowe though)
 
trundler

trundler

Request Your Custom Title Now!
Prince EWS said:
Chanders did it a lot even when the game was still live though.

I think the criticisms of Waugh, Kallis etc doing this are way overblown and I basically just ignore them, but it was actually quite visibly true with Chanders. The worst thing about it was his refusal to go up the order. If you're crap at accelerating or farming the strike with the tail you should at least be open to batting in the top four to see if that works.
Click to expand...
Yeah all this makes Chanders a lot less valuable in practice than his numbers suggest, even in the context of a lower middle order batsman playing in an easy era. Chanderpaul batting till the end did not ensure that the maximum possible runs that could've been scored were scored as he made no attempts to protect the tail and get as many runs as possible.

There's a Gandhi who wants to stand up for him every time he's brought up but really no one rates him as highly as his raw numbers demand. I got hounded for suggesting he's a mid-40s average batsman with a flattering average last time but now he's losing to both Lloyd and Crowe. 🤔
 
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