Harold Larwood vs Barry Richards

[Johan]

two guys with absurdly high reputation but international careers that leave a little to be desired.

 

[capt_Luffy]

The guy with an ATG Test Series ig

 

[subshakerz]

Voted Barry for Kyears sake.

 

[Johan]

Who had a bigger peer reputation before the digital age? I know Larwood was seen above Lindwall and Trueman, where was Barry put?

 

[capt_Luffy]

Above Lindwall and Trueman means Larwood was rated as the best outright pacer till Lillee came in the 70s. Don't think Barry was ever rated over Hobbs.

 

[kyear2]

Who had a bigger peer reputation before the digital age? I know Larwood was seen above Lindwall and Trueman, where was Barry put?

When Barry emerged the ceiling wasn't Pollock or even Sobers, I'll just leave it as that.

Bradman said he was the best opener he's ever seen. Yes, he clarified at least the equal if not the superior of Hobbs (who I'm not sure if he caught in his absolute prime) and Hutton.

Gooch, Dickie Bird, Procter, G. Pollock, Thompson, Lillee, Willis, Snow, all counted him as the best opener they've seen, though many of them outright cited him as the outright best batsman they've witnessed, and on par with Sobers and Richards.

He was the consensus best batsman in the world for the first half of the '70's.

So yeah, I'll say it was B.A. Richards.

 

[Patience and Accuracy+Gut]

 

[sayon basak]

@Coronis voting for Larwood is something I never anticipated.

 

[kyear2]

Who had a bigger peer reputation before the digital age? I know Larwood was seen above Lindwall and Trueman, where was Barry put?

I've always heard and understood it to be Lindwall that passed the baton of GOAT to Lillee.

 

[Johan]

I've always heard and understood it to be Lindwall that passed the baton of GOAT to Lillee.

that's the Australian belief/narrative.

 

[kyear2]

that's the Australian belief/narrative.

Conversely can't yours be seen as the British belief / narrative?

Lindwall seemed always to be rated higher this part of the world.

 

[Johan]

Conversely can't yours be seen as the British belief / narrative?

Lindwall seemed always to be rated higher this part of the world.

Pretty confident that Larwood is rated higher by Australians than he is/was by the English.

Regardless, naturally, before Lillee/Marshall, countries had different GOAT pacers for different nations.

 

[sayon basak]

Pretty confident that Larwood is rated higher by Australians than he is/was by the English.

Provide some source to back it up.

 

[Johan]

Provide some source to back it up.

when Larwood moved to Australia in 1950, he was given lots of respect by their Cricketers and the state, they paid his bills and stuff and Harold would himself go on to admit “In the 1950s I got treated better by the countries I didn’t play for. The country I did play for didn’t really want to know me” Overall, he was not exactly a very respected figure in england until he was near death/died, and I remember Richie Benaud rating him EXTREMELY highly.

 

[Johan]

I just remembered, this was Ray Lindwall's top ten fast bowlers list, Larwood at very top, no doubt Larwood was held in very high regard in Australia.

1. Harold Larwood
2. Dennis Lillee
3. Fred Trueman
4. Keith Miller
5. Wes Hall
6. Michael Holding
7. Frank Tyson
8. Alan Davidson
9. Bill Johnston
10. Jeff Thomson

 

[Coronis]

@Coronis voting for Larwood is something I never anticipated.

Why?

 

[sayon basak]

Why?

I don't know. I thought you don't rate Larwood that highly, and thought you'd rate Barry higher as you rate Procter pretty high.

 

[kyear2]

I just remembered, this was Ray Lindwall's top ten fast bowlers list, Larwood at very top, no doubt Larwood was held in very high regard in Australia.

1. Harold Larwood
2. Dennis Lillee
3. Fred Trueman
4. Keith Miller
5. Wes Hall
6. Michael Holding
7. Frank Tyson
8. Alan Davidson
9. Bill Johnston
10. Jeff Thomson

But you literally just said that Lindwall being the GOAT prior to Lillee was just the Australian perspective.

In any event, highly rated doesn't equate to being rated ahead of Lindwall, which as I said, I don't recall seeing or reading previously.

 

[Johan]

But you literally just said that Lindwall being the GOAT prior to Lillee was just the Australian perspective.

In any event, highly rated doesn't equate to being rated ahead of Lindwall, which as I said, I don't recall seeing or reading previously.

? The Idea Lillee took over the GOAT mantle from Lindwall is not a universal agreement, many don't agree with that idea. Larwood's rating went down over time naturally, as his statistics are not that impressive, he wasn't rated as highly in 1970s as he was in 1940s and 1950s, as Bodyline faded into being a distant memory. Lindwall and Trueman are statistically far superior, so their reputation stayed.

 

[Coronis]

I don't know. I thought you don't rate Larwood that highly, and thought you'd rate Barry higher as you rate Procter pretty high.

Larwood defs had a more impressive test career. He also has a crazier FC record than Richards.