Allan Knott vs Ben Stokes

[sayon basak]

The better cricketer?

 

[Johan]

Extremely close, Stokes had recently reverted to a borderline part time bowler though he's returning, I guess Knott for now but if Stokes has a good run of form with both the bat and the ball like he did between 2016 and 2019, it would be him.

 

[sayon basak]

Extremely close, Stokes had recently reverted to a borderline part time bowler though he's returning, I guess Knott for now but if Stokes has a good run of form with both the bat and the ball like he did between 2016 and 2019, it would be him.

That ain't happening.

 

[Johan]

That ain't happening.

we said that about Shubhman Gill scoring runs overseas too.

 

[sayon basak]

we said that about Shubhman Gill scoring runs overseas too.

Stokes is not as good as Gill.

Seriously tho, Gill would probably get a reality check in the next match. Great series already tho.

 

[Johan]

Seriously tho, Gill would probably get a reality check in the next match. Great series already tho.

McCullum has asked for a greener, bouncier and faster pitch for Lord's and they mostly refuse to make roads regardless, should be a good one.

 

[Al Salvador]

Love knott. Very fine cricketer. God keeper and a good lower order batsman but keeping as a skill is simply isn't anywhere near as valuable as bowling. Even with God keeping of Knott, it's not enough to beat Stokes. While knott was a good bat, Stokes is tier ahead as batsman.

 

[Cricket Bliss]

Stokes a bit more better with the bat ( gets overrated a bit for having knocks that are memorable)
Although bowling has more impact than keeping Stokes is just a decent bowler in comparison with an ATG keeper, so it’s Knott

 

[Fuller Pilch]

Knott.
Stokes would need to score more runs and captain England to the Ashes.

 

[Johan]

Stokes a bit more better with the bat ( gets overrated a bit for having knocks that are memorable)
Although bowling has more impact than keeping Stokes is just a decent bowler in comparison with an ATG keeper, so it’s Knott

Stokes is easily better with the bat. Twice as likely to make hundreds, 4 more runs per innings, better strike rate and as you said, he actually played some of the best innings. Knott better against spin but Stokes against pace, and the latter matters more given team configurations and conditions.

 

[kyear2]

Stokes a bit more better with the bat ( gets overrated a bit for having knocks that are memorable)
Although bowling has more impact than keeping Stokes is just a decent bowler in comparison with an ATG keeper, so it’s Knott

Basically all of this, and I'm not even sure if Stokes really was a bit better with the bat. Seems pretty close to me. Knott was a fighter.

 

[Al Salvador]

Basically all of this, and I'm not even sure if Stokes really was a bit better with the bat. Seems pretty close to me. Knott was a fighter.

Jeez this is ridiculous, no way they're close as batsman. Stokes has 13 test hundreds ffs. There's literally 4 RPI gap between the two, Stokes had a success in top 5 and has played some of the greatest innings of all time. Reached immense height like 2019 Ashes. I hope you put forward your argument about them being close as batsman, you said due to average right? you talk about strike rate all the time, fwiw stokes' strike rate is close to 60.

 

[Cricket Bliss]

Jeez this is ridiculous, no way they're close as batsman. Stokes has 13 test hundreds ffs. There's literally 4 RPI gap between the two, Stokes had a success in top 5 and has played some of the greatest innings of all time. Reached immense height like 2019 Ashes. I hope you put forward your argument about them being close as batsman, you said due to average right? you talk about strike rate all the time, fwiw stokes' strike rate is close to 60.

Don’t think Strike Rate matters much in Tests! Knott averages 57 in West Indies and 62 in Pakistan
Knott has a 50 in every 4.25 innings
Stokes also has a 50 in every 4.25 innings
Stokes was a match winner, Knott more to draw tests that were to be lost.

 

[Johan]

Don’t think Strike Rate matters much in Tests! Knott averages 57 in West Indies and 62 in Pakistan

......so? I doubt late 60s/Early 70s West Indies and Pakistan pitches or bowling lineups were much to write about.

 

[Cricket Bliss]

......so? I doubt late 60s/Early 70s West Indies and Pakistan pitches or bowling lineups were much to write about.

Knott has a Hundred at home against peak Roberts, Daniel and a young Holding in 76’

His highest score came against Thomson and Pascoe in 77’

One against peak Lillee and Thomson of 74-75.

Knott in fact scored 364 runs in the 74-75 Ashes… for a cricketer having batting as his secondary discipline 300 runs sounds equivalent to 500 for a pure batsmen.

Stokes is definitely the better bat, but not enough better as his around 3 times more 100s showcase.

 

[Johan]

Knott has a Hundred at home against peak Roberts, Daniel and a young Holding in 76’

His highest score came against Thomson and Pascoe in 77’

One against peak Lillee and Thomson of 74-75.

Knott in fact scored 364 runs in the 74-75 Ashes… for a cricketer having batting as his secondary discipline 300 runs sounds equivalent to 500 for a pure batsmen.

Stokes is definitely the better bat, but not enough better as his around 3 times more 100s showcase.

...Ok? Stokes scored just as much if not more than that in the last. In 2019 Ashes he scored 441 runs and in 2023 he scored another 405 runs.

And he was playing the great Australian attacks after all, Cummins, Hazlewood, Starc and Lyon.

Stokes also scored an away hundred in South Africa against Rabada and Philander, two of the most dominant pacers at home.

No matter how you slice it, Stokes is easily the better batsman and it's not close enough to be a debate.

 

[OverratedSanity]

Close overall but no way is Knott anywhere near Stokes as a batsman

 

[Al Salvador]

Close overall but no way is Knott anywhere near Stokes as a batsman

My hot take is if Knott was actually a Stokes-level batsman in ability, he would be challenging Gilchrist in that greatest wicketkeeper batsman of all time debate. Stokes is a top 6 batsman, and his average undersells his ability because he has had a lot of mitigating factors throughout his career. It feels like people decided they're close as batsmen by simply reading off Cricinfo averages. Prior averages 40, and Stokes is a significantly better batsman than him too.

 

[Cricket Bliss]

...Ok? Stokes scored just as much if not more than that in the last. In 2019 Ashes he scored 441 runs and in 2023 he scored another 405 runs.

And he was playing the great Australian attacks after all, Cummins, Hazlewood, Starc and Lyon.

Stokes also scored an away hundred in South Africa against Rabada and Philander, two of the most dominant pacers at home.

No matter how you slice it, Stokes is easily the better batsman and it's not close enough to be a debate.

read my last sentence
Stokes averages more than 40 only in South Africa. Yes he has 52 in the most difficult conditions for batting.
whereas Knott averages more than 40 in three countries- West Indies , Pakistan and New Zealand
The New Zealand Knott faced was particularly weak and is just low sample, but Stokes also has played in such weak countries and didn’t average well.
Overall If I’m dividing my tier for batsmen with batting as their secondary discipline + Stokes
then i will have (not including all players)
Tier 1 : Stokes, Dhoni
Tier 2 : Imran, Botham, Kapil
Tier 3 : Knott, Flintoff
Tier 4 : Hadlee, Marsh, Healy

 

[Cricket Bliss]

My hot take is if Knott was actually a Stokes-level batsman in ability, he would be challenging Gilchrist in that greatest wicketkeeper batsman of all time debate. Stokes is a top 6 batsman, and his average undersells his ability because he has had a lot of mitigating factors throughout his career. It feels like people decided they're close as batsmen by simply reading off Cricinfo averages. Prior averages 40, and Stokes is a significantly better batsman than him too.

Knott is almost unarguably second in the list of wicket keeper batsmen only behind Gilchrist