Rahul Dravid vs Kevin Pietersen (talent)

[subshakerz]

Bradman was just a freak able to uniquely combine those two skills.

Yes freakishly talented. If it were that easy to train on this it's been 75 years and nobody has replicated that formula. As if it's that easy 'yknow I will practice playing faster and playing longer, golly nobody has thought of that one'.

If nothing else he must have unusually good stamina for his time.

 

[sayon basak]

Yeah its ridiculous

What advantages do you think he had to average double the amount of other batters mentioned? Three eyes?

 

[subshakerz]

What advantages do you think he had to average double the amount of other batters mentioned? Three eyes?

Stamina.

Ability to read bowlers easier than any bat his generation..

Exceptional reflexes likely.

 

[Coronis]

Yes freakishly talented. If it were that easy to train on this it's been 75 years and nobody has replicated that formula. As if it's that easy 'yknow I will practice playing faster and playing longer, golly nobody has thought of that one'.

If nothing else he must have unusually good stamina for his time.

Mental fatigue is a real big one, in any sport, as well as physical fatigue of course. Stamina is quite underrated sometimes in sports. I know a lot of bball references get thrown around here at times, so I’ll do another. Steph Curry for example, part of the reason he is such a problem is because of his stamina, whenever he’s on the floor he never ever stops moving without the ball, wearing down defenders significantly just from chasing him.

In the case of Bradman vs say Lara (who has a similar SR) Bradman would just be able to evidently bat for a much longer period of time (relatively) mistake free. Conversely, someone like Sutcliffe could bat for a similar number of overs without a mistake, yet not bat as fast.

You combine Sutcliffe’s staying power with Lara’s SR, and that’s Bradman.

 

[Johan]

I don't see how it being innate changes anything.

Mid late 90s you had four worldclass pace bowling duos and at least 2-3 worldclass spinners. Even Zimbabwe had Heath Streak.

Why would it be a point anyway? the actual difference is strike rates, not averages.

as always, average attack on a bad wicket > ATG attack on a good wicket

 

[sayon basak]

Stamina.

Ability to read bowlers easier than any bat his generation..

Exceptional reflexes likely.

If stamina is a talent, why isn't discipline also a talent?

 

[Agonizingly Awkward]

I don’t think Bradman was born with any special advantage over Sachin, Smith or Lara. As to why nobody else can average 99.94, nobody has had his application or mental application, to stay for 27 overs on average themselves at the crease whilst striking at 60. People can strike that fast, but not stay in as long, and people can stay in for a similar amount of time, but not strike as fast. Its not that those guys and others didn’t work hard, Bradman was just a freak able to uniquely combine those two skills.

Your first statement contradict your last statement. He was not born with a special talent and was simultaneously a freak who could easily do two of the hardest things in batting.

 

[subshakerz]

If stamina is a talent, why isn't discipline also a talent?

Exceptional physical stamina is part of natural gifts.

 

[subshakerz]

Why would it be a point anyway? the actual difference is strike rates, not averages.

as always, average attack on a bad wicket > ATG attack on a good wicket

If modern bats are more risk taking often at a detriment and not as defensively tight, better bowlers will do better against them.

And the wicket difference to me is not huge.

 

[Johan]

If modern bats are more risk taking often at a detriment and not as defensively tight, better bowlers will do better against them.

And the wicket difference to me is not huge.

bring Sachin post-2018 and he won't even end up averaging 50 ngl (granted conditions don't change for another decade and so)

 

[subshakerz]

bring Sachin post-2018 and he won't even end up averaging 50 ngl (granted conditions don't change for another decade and so)

Sachin in the 90s averaged 58. Pretty sure you take that Sachin he averages 50 plus in this era too.

 

[Johan]

Sachin in the 90s averaged 58. Pretty sure you take that Sachin he averages 50 plus in this era too.

peak Sachin would but overall say he debuted for India in 2018 and retires in 2030s he won't average 50 like he did in his career span, granted pitches remain the way they are right now.

 

[subshakerz]

peak Sachin would but overall say he debuted for India in 2018 and retires in 2030s he won't average 50 like he did in his career span, granted pitches remain the way they are right now.

I think he could still manage it, he would shave maybe 2-3 point on that average.

That's assuming he faced the same bowlers in his career.

 

[PlayerComparisons]

Perhaps Sachin would be a bit worse if he played lots of t20s

 

[ma1978]

peak Sachin would but overall say he debuted for India in 2018 and retires in 2030s he won't average 50 like he did in his career span, granted pitches remain the way they are right now.

you mean like the pitches the last four tests have been played. Sachin would have 800 runs already

 

[Johan]

you mean like the pitches the last four tests have been played. Sachin would have 800 runs already

don't be dishonest, you know this series is not in India, is unusually flat due to the hottest summer in England since 1920s. What about the pitches in Australia in the BGT? or 2021 Ashes?

 

[ma1978]

don't be dishonest, you know this series is not in India, is unusually flat due to the hottest summer in England since 1920s. What about the pitches in Australia in the BGT? or 2021 Ashes?

there’s nothing in the pitches or the quality of bowling that makes batting harder than the 1990s, don’t try to justify this to aggrandize Joe Root

 

[Johan]

there’s nothing in the pitches or the quality of bowling that makes batting easier than the 1990s, don’t try to justify this to aggrandize Joe Root

There is, and there are also other factors, the Kookabura bowl went through redevelopment in early 2020s to make it have a larger and much more durable seam, for example, which greatly increased the duration of movement.

Batters scrambling: The new Kookaburra ball that seams to wreak havoc

Everyone is fretting about green pitches, but a change of ball is an equal factor in shorter, speedier Test matches in Australia.

www.smh.com.au

that's just one example, mathematically we are seeing the lowest scoring era in all of Cricket since 1950s. The bowling average since 2018 have gone down below 30, the first time this has happened since 1950s, no other decade even registers a sub 31 average, let alone sub 30.

 

[OverratedSanity]

Root plays in a low scoring era, I suppose but a lot of this is also balanced out by the Bazball era post 2021 English pitches which have been disgracefully flat highways. People acting like he's Hobbs in the 1910s are taking it a bit far.

 

[Johan]

Root plays in a low scoring era, I suppose but a lot of this is also balanced out by the Bazball era post 2021 English pitches which have been disgracefully flat highways. People acting like he's Hobbs in the 1910s are taking it a bit far.

I agree though Disgracefully flat highways is exaggerating it a fair but, before this series it was pretty okay.