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Thread: India vs India

  1. #1
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    India vs India

    AD Gaekwad, NS Sidhu, DB Vengsarkar, SM Gavaskar, AO Malhotra, NS Yadav, RJ Shastri, RMH Binny, N Kapil Dev, SMH Kirmani, Maninder Singh.

    This is the 83 Indian team, same again how do posters think the current Indian team would go against them.

  2. #2
    Hall of Fame Member FaaipDeOiad's Avatar
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    India were pretty weak then really. Aside from Kapil and Gavaskar, there's not much to write home about in that team. Obviously with players like Vengsarkar as well the batting is pretty good, but I'd take Kumble and Harbhajan over that spin attack any day, and Tendulkar, Dravid and Sehwag make up for the test. Easily stronger today.

    Are you trying to prove some sort of point with these posts btw? If you post West Indies, Pakistan or New Zealand teams you'll get the opposite response.
    It's cold on the outside they say
    But the cold leaves you clear while the heat leaves a haze

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    Quote Originally Posted by FaaipDeOiad

    Are you trying to prove some sort of point with these posts btw? If you post West Indies, Pakistan or New Zealand teams you'll get the opposite response.
    Would you be so quick with Pakistan knowing these are the teams.

    Shafiq Ahmed, Sadiq Mohammad, Majid Khan, Javed Miandad, Wasim Bari, Zaheer Abbas, Wasim Raja, Imran Khan, Sarfraz Nawaz, Iqbal Qasim, Mohammad Nazir.

    Vs

    Taufeeq Umar, Naved Latif, Younis Khan, Inzamam-ul-Haq, Yousuf Youhana, Abdul Razzaq, Rashid Latif, Saqlain Mushtaq, Waqar Younis, Shoaib Akhtar, Danish Kaneria.

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    This is NZs two teams.

    MH Richardson, L Vincent, SP Fleming, CD McMillan, NJ Astle, SB Styris, JDP Oram, RG Hart, DL Vettori, DR Tuffey, SE Bond.

    Vs

    JG Wright, PA Horne, JJ Crowe, MD Crowe, DN Patel, JV Coney, JG Bracewell, RJ Hadlee, IDS Smith, MC Snedden, EJ Chatfield.

    How do the NZers posters think these two teams would go.


  5. #5
    Hall of Fame Member FaaipDeOiad's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Scallywag
    Would you be so quick with Pakistan knowing these are the teams.

    Shafiq Ahmed, Sadiq Mohammad, Majid Khan, Javed Miandad, Wasim Bari, Zaheer Abbas, Wasim Raja, Imran Khan, Sarfraz Nawaz, Iqbal Qasim, Mohammad Nazir.

    Vs

    Taufeeq Umar, Naved Latif, Younis Khan, Inzamam-ul-Haq, Yousuf Youhana, Abdul Razzaq, Rashid Latif, Saqlain Mushtaq, Waqar Younis, Shoaib Akhtar, Danish Kaneria.
    Why are you choosing those teams, though? Waqar Younis and Rashid Latif don't even play any more. And there are better Pakistani teams than that in the 80s, it really depends what period you are going for.

    I'd still go for the 80s one anyway, because it looks like that's an early 80s team, and Imran Khan was an awesome force with the ball and Sarfraz and Qasim isn't bad support at all. Then you've got two great batsmen in Javed Miandad and Zaheer Abbas. In the later team, Waqar Younis would obviously be old and well past his best, and while the test of the bowling is good isn't certainly not significantly better than what was available in the former team.
    Last edited by FaaipDeOiad; 27-07-2005 at 03:21 AM.

  6. #6
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    You know whats strange ?
    How almost everybody acknowledges Vengsarkar as a 'good' batsman while ignoring Jimmy Amarnath.....whereas most knowledgable indian fans rate Jimmy as considerably better....Jimmy totally lost form near the end of his career ( had a run of single digit scores) but for most of his career, he was an assured player of spin and one of the best player of fast bowling.

    And yes, India back then would get trounced by India currently.

    As per Scallywag's idiotic post about Pakistan, i have to laugh really.

    For one, he does an excellent job of picking a weak, if not the weakest Pakistani team of the late 70s/80s to try and make his point.

    Apparently Shafiq Ahmed, who played a 'massive' six matches averaging 11 gets mentioned but Shoaib Mohammed with 45 matches and 45-ish average is not worth mention.

    Majid Khan, who made his bread and butter as an opener, gets relegated to # 3 in favour of Sadiq Mohammed..

    Apparently Wasim Raja deserves mention but Saleem Malik ( who played more matches in the 80s than 90s btw) is ignored.

    Apparently Mohammed Nazir playing all of 14 tests and averaging 30+ with the ball deserves to be mentioned from the '70s/80s team' over Akram.

    Strangely, no Abdul Qadir.......

    I suppose with dishonesty and distortions like these, debating is useless.

    I think THIS team would be a bit better representation of PAK through the late 70s and 80s:


    Majid Khan
    Shoaib Mohammed
    Mudasser Nazar
    Zaheer Abbass
    Javed Miandad
    Saleem Malik
    Imran Khan
    Wasim Akram
    Wasim Bari
    Abdul Qadir
    Iqbal Qasim/Sarfaraz Nawaz( depending on pitch).

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    Quote Originally Posted by FaaipDeOiad
    Why are you choosing those teams, though? Waqar Younis and Rashid Latif don't even play any more. And there are better Pakistani teams than that in the 80s, it really depends what period you are going for.

    I'd still go for the 80s one anyway, because it looks like that's an early 80s team, and Imran Khan was an awesome force with the ball and Sarfraz and Qasim isn't bad support at all. Then you've got two great batsmen in Javed Miandad and Zaheer Abbas. In the later team, Waqar Younis would obviously be old and well past his best, and while the test of the bowling is good isn't certainly not significantly better than what was available in the former team.
    Because I think that the WI v Aus has been done to death and there are other teams and players that play cricket.

    I'm not going for any period in particular but comparing randomly picked teams and looking for opinions on how they would go.

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    Quote Originally Posted by C_C


    I suppose with dishonesty and distortions like these, debating is useless.
    Care to explain what is dishonset and distorted C_C.

  9. #9
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    Quote Originally Posted by Scallywag
    Care to explain what is dishonset and distorted C_C.
    You trying to compare a PAK team with bulk of the members who have hardly played test cricket or arnt the best of the lot with an almost full-strength PAK team over the last 4-5 years.
    A better comparison would be the PAK team that faced AUS in sharjah with yer 80s lineup.

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    Quote Originally Posted by C_C
    You trying to compare a PAK team with bulk of the members who have hardly played test cricket or arnt the best of the lot with an almost full-strength PAK team over the last 4-5 years.
    A better comparison would be the PAK team that faced AUS in sharjah with yer 80s lineup.
    No C_C I compared the Pakistan team that played WI in 1981 and lost 0-1 in a four test series.

    http://www.cricinfo.com/db/ARCHIVE/1...04JAN1981.html

    Test # 892 (889/19)
    Pakistan v West Indies, 1980/81, 4th Test
    Ibn-e-Qasim Bagh Stadium, Multan
    30,31 December 1980, 2,3,4 January 1981 (5-day match)

    Result: Match drawn
    West Indies wins the 4-Test series 1-0



    So what you are saying is the WI team comprising of DL Haynes, SFAF Bacchus, IVA Richards, AI Kallicharran, HA Gomes, CH Lloyd, DA Murray, ST Clarke, MD Marshall, J Garner, CEH Croft. played and I'll use your own words "weakest Pakistani team of the late 70s/80s" and only managed to beat them 1-0.

    You still havent pointed out where I was dishonest and distorted things.

  11. #11
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    So what you are saying is the WI team comprising of DL Haynes, SFAF Bacchus, IVA Richards, AI Kallicharran, HA Gomes, CH Lloyd, DA Murray, ST Clarke, MD Marshall, J Garner, CEH Croft. played and I'll use your own words "weakest Pakistani team of the late 70s/80s" and only managed to beat them 1-0.
    Yup.
    but then again, i will rely on you to distort the stats to suit yer pro-aussie perspective.
    You'd do well to realise that the series was adversely affected by rain.
    1st test had 2 days wiped out, third test lost two evening sessions(which PAK managed to draw by the skin of their teeth) and the 4th test had the entire last day plus 2 sessions of day4 wiped out by rain.

    Good going with the facts-distortions and dishonesty, mate.

    You still havent pointed out where I was dishonest and distorted things.
    I already have but you chose to ignore it.
    Your comparisons are highly skewed, since you are comparing really weak teams from the 80s that played the odd games or a series with full strength or near-full strength teams playing currently.
    Its would be like saying an Indian team minus 5 regulars beat a full strength OZ team minus Warne by 7 wickts in 96 is proof enough of aussie ineptitude.


    PS: aussie aussie aussie. oi oi oi !

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    Quote Originally Posted by C_C

    Good going with the facts-distortions and dishonesty, mate.


    So exactaly what fact has been distorted C_C.

    I have given you the link to the game so if you really are a man show me what has been distorted and dishonest.

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    and here is the Pakistan team from 03 v SA

    http://www.cricinfo.com/db/ARCHIVE/2...21OCT2003.html


    Looks like you tried to distort thing through dishonesty C_C.

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    Quote Originally Posted by C_C

    I think THIS team would be a bit better representation of PAK through the late 70s and 80s:


    Majid Khan
    Shoaib Mohammed
    Mudasser Nazar
    Zaheer Abbass
    Javed Miandad
    Saleem Malik
    Imran Khan
    Wasim Akram
    Wasim Bari
    Abdul Qadir
    Iqbal Qasim/Sarfaraz Nawaz( depending on pitch).
    Can you provide a link to the series that this team played.

  15. #15
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    Quote Originally Posted by Scallywag
    So exactaly what fact has been distorted C_C.

    I have given you the link to the game so if you really are a man show me what has been distorted and dishonest.

    I already have told you what you've distorted and where you are being dishonest.
    Incase yer English is rusty, i would like to remind you that 'dishonest' is synonymous with 'misleading' and you are being misleading here to attempt discrediting the WI of the late 70s/80s by trying to say that they couldnt even beat a weak Pakistani team convincingly...without taking into consideration the circumstances such as weather.
    Or by trying to throw up weak teams that played maybe a match or two together as an example of 'the kind of teams WI beat'.
    I suppose if OZ plays a FC series against Mongolia and all but 2 sessions per match is rained out, it would be very apt to say " the AUS team comprising of M Hayden, J Langer, R.Ponting, D.Martyn,M.Clarke,A.Gillchrist,S.Warne.G.McGrath.B .Lee,J.Gillespie and S.Katich played the weakest team on the planet and only managed to draw the series"

    You are being dishonest by making an inappropriate comparison - between regular full strength or near-full strength teams of the present with the odd-ball team that played a few matches.
    Thats like trying to compare this current WI team's performance and strength as a barometer with the WI team of the mid 90s.

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