England players and selection discussion thread

[LangleyburyCCPlayer]

We’re not exactly blessed with spinners at the moment, but if Bashir gets the nod, it must mean that they actually rate him as a spinner for the here and now rather than picking him based on attributes; we’re not in the business of building for an away Ashes anymore, and he’s never getting into any team on the strength of his batting! He’s been sitting on his arse for the last month (all useful experience though eh KP?), but I do think Ahmed is the better option even as a spinner, it’s good to see Bashir finally get a run of games at county level, but he’s merely been OK in Division 2, whereas what little county pedigree that Ahmed has is still better than Bashir’s

 

[kevinw]

Given that Archer's team is now out of the IPL, just bring him back for the first test!

 

[LangleyburyCCPlayer]

Given that Archer's team is now out of the IPL, just bring him back for the first test!

He’s going to Barbados first!

 

[LangleyburyCCPlayer]

England Lions threaten to restrict the lead after a burst in the morning, but the South African tail wag and they end on 278, 85 ahead

 

[kevinw]

England Lions threaten to restrict the lead after a burst in the morning, but the South African tail wag and they end on 278, 85 ahead

And later collapse themselves with the last four wickets adding just two runs so SAf help themselves to an easy eight wicket win. Men against boys.

 

[Molehill]

I think Crocombe, who has been in England Lions squads in the past and who has had a good start to the season, might be one of the next cabs off the rank, but apart from him, the seamers are all very inexperienced

I've watched Crocombe a lot and had never really thought of him as an England prospect. Indeed, if he was getting a game in the last 2 seasons it was often because Robinson wasn't available. His form this season has been a pleasant surprise, but if England end up picking him, then I feel something has gone majorly wrong elsewhere.

https://www.espncricinfo.com/story/brendon-mccullum-signals-ben-stokes-jamie-smith-swap-england-batting-order-1538846

Sounds like Smith and Stokes swapping places is likely, Smith is definitely a better batter these days, although I don’t think this will make a huge amount of difference, I don’t think the difference between 6 and 7 is as big as the difference between batting in the top order or batting in the middle order. Maybe Cricinfo know more than I do, but the way that I read this is that Ehantharajah thinks Ahmed being picked for the Lions game makes him less likely to play the first Test, if anything I interpret it differently, Ahmed hasn’t played since round 2 of the County Championship so I think it’s important to get him match fit with the Test on the horizon

Got a feeling this could make a big difference to Smith. He can play more as a proper batsmen (which I think he is) than a number 7 basher (which occasionally came off but doesn't really seem his natural game as his ODI exploits seem to confirm). The recent form of Stokes with the bat would question whether he should be above 8!

 

[Chin Music]

I think Crocombe, who has been in England Lions squads in the past and who has had a good start to the season, might be one of the next cabs off the rank, but apart from him, the seamers are all very inexperienced

Weren't a lot of the players in the Lions team very inexperienced? Tribe, Mayes, Singh, Jack and Sharma have all played under 30 FC games (Singh and Sharma and Jack significantly less) and even McKinney and Geddes only just over that mark.

 

[Molehill]

You could also question what someone like Paterson was doing in the SA side at the age of 37 (one of 5 players over 30 in the team I think). A very strange mismatch on experience and the results have not been surprising.

 

[Chin Music]

You could also question what someone like Paterson was doing in the SA side at the age of 37 (one of 5 players over 30 in the team I think). A very strange mismatch on experience and the results have not been surprising.

Well there was no significant batting depth in terms of specialist bats who are likely challengers to the test side with the obvious exception of Tribe. Strange indeed.

 

[zaremba]

I've watched Crocombe a lot and had never really thought of him as an England prospect. Indeed, if he was getting a game in the last 2 seasons it was often because Robinson wasn't available. His form this season has been a pleasant surprise, but if England end up picking him, then I feel something has gone majorly wrong elsewhere.

Agree. And his stats don't suggest Test quality: after 47 matches he averages over 36 with a solitary 5 wicket haul.

 

[Kenneth Viljoen]

You could also question what someone like Paterson was doing in the SA side at the age of 37 (one of 5 players over 30 in the team I think). A very strange mismatch on experience and the results have not been surprising.

Nqobani Mokoena is 19 and Tiaan Van Vuuren is 24 , both have barely played cricket outside South Africa, needed an experienced County pro like Paterson to guide them

 

[Molehill]

Nqobani Mokoena is 19 and Tiaan Van Vuuren is 24 , both have barely played cricket outside South Africa, needed an experienced County pro like Paterson to guide them

And to be honest, I don't really disagree with this approach. But the England Selectors clearly do, which is probably why the Lions keep on getting beaten by teams with far more experience.

 

[kevinw]

Wasn't the point here that these guys were not selected for the Blast/able to skip it, so the side wouldn't be as experienced as it could be as a genuine second string side. That said, Lions squads don't tend to actually be that. This is the kind of game Sonny Baker should've played in, for example.

 

[Molehill]

Wasn't the point here that these guys were not selected for the Blast/able to skip it, so the side wouldn't be as experienced as it could be as a genuine second string side. That said, Lions squads don't tend to actually be that. This is the kind of game Sonny Baker should've played in, for example.

But Mousley is surely a regular for the Bears in the Blast, meanwhile (as I previously mentioned), Haines is doing eff all down at Hove. He'd have been a far more obvious captaincy candidate and bat top order. They can't even work out how to pick a half decent Lions side.

 

[Nas207]

I think both sides were too extreme. Your A side is an opportunity to blood young talent. Sa was almost entirely over 30, which seems a waste. Equally its not just a developmental squad. Should be more fringe players there.

 

[LangleyburyCCPlayer]

I think both sides were too extreme. Your A side is an opportunity to blood young talent. Sa was almost entirely over 30, which seems a waste. Equally its not just a developmental squad. Should be more fringe players there.

I think if you’re picking your next cabs off the rank who are around 30 and have a genuine shot of playing Tests again in the near future, that’s absolutely fine, Paterson is 37, his last Test was over 2 years ago and it was the one in which they fielded a B side against New Zealand, I get the point about having an experienced hand to figuratively hold the hands of the youngsters, but they don’t have to be that old!

 

[LangleyburyCCPlayer]

I've watched Crocombe a lot and had never really thought of him as an England prospect. Indeed, if he was getting a game in the last 2 seasons it was often because Robinson wasn't available. His form this season has been a pleasant surprise, but if England end up picking him, then I feel something has gone majorly wrong elsewhere.



Got a feeling this could make a big difference to Smith. He can play more as a proper batsmen (which I think he is) than a number 7 basher (which occasionally came off but doesn't really seem his natural game as his ODI exploits seem to confirm). The recent form of Stokes with the bat would question whether he should be above 8!

Even though Stokes’ batting has massively declined, he has a track record of batting tremendously with the tail! It does seem that having that clarity of knowing exactly what he needs to do helps Stokes, rather than getting caught in two minds about attacking or defending

 

[kevinw]

But Mousley is surely a regular for the Bears in the Blast, meanwhile (as I previously mentioned), Haines is doing eff all down at Hove. He'd have been a far more obvious captaincy candidate and bat top order. They can't even work out how to pick a half decent Lions side.

I agree with that. Mousley will only ever play t20is for England and is a very, very average FC bat. So makes little sense selecting him for these games.

 

[govinda indian fan]

Even though Stokes’ batting has massively declined, he has a track record of batting tremendously with the tail! It does seem that having that clarity of knowing exactly what he needs to do helps Stokes, rather than getting caught in two minds about attacking or defending

Stokes actually batted well last summer. In Australia every english batter bar root&bethell failed. Imo On flat pitches in england stokes would find his mojo back

 

[LangleyburyCCPlayer]

Stokes actually batted well last summer. In Australia every english batter bar root&bethell failed. Imo On flat pitches in england stokes would find his mojo back

His ton at Old Trafford on the deadest pitch in England for a long time did a lot of heavy lifting, he didn’t even hit a 50 apart from that