Australian Discussion (Final Squad Announced Post #82)

[TumTum]

With the Marsh exclusion I'm starting to jump on the sack the selectors bandwagon. Haddin has always been a fill-in opener.

 

[Mr Mxyzptlk]

With the Marsh exclusion I'm starting to jump on the sack the selectors bandwagon. Haddin has always been a fill-in opener.

A fill-in for Gilchrist, evidently.

 

[Prince EWS]

I don't like Marsh opening in ODIs. I don't mind him down the order but he gets bogged down against the new ball unless he's trying to blast it T20 style.

Opening in ODIs:

		Mat	Inns	NO	Runs	HS	Ave	SR	100	50

Brad Haddin	30	30	1	984	110	33.93	85.04	2	5
Shaun Marsh	26	26	1	928	112	37.12	73.82	1	6

Marsh has the higher average, but Haddin's strike rate is much better and I feel it's really important to score runs off the new ball and take advantage of that first PP in the subcontinent. Batting just gets harder on slower pitches as the ball gets older and the spinners come on.

Haddin's also got to bat somewhere, and he really struggles to score against spin early in his innings, so I'd stay away from batting him in the middle order if I could avoid it.

I don't mind Marsh in the team if he comes in for Hussey but I'd bat him at six or so rather than open with him.

 

[Spikey]

Haddin's average also suffers from the pre-Gilchirst retirement games he got. Since he took-over full-time he's closer to 40 than 30. Madness to move him.

 

[Prince EWS]

Haddin's average also suffers from the pre-Gilchirst retirement games he got. Since he took-over full-time he's closer to 40 than 30. Madness to move him.

Yeah that's true. In the last 26 ODIs he's opened in he's averaged 37.88 and struck at 87.68.

 

[Nate]

Watson
Haddin
Marsh
Ponting
Ferguson
Hussey
Smith
O'Keefe/Lyon
Johnson/or someone useful
Lee
Bollinger

imo

 

[Cevno]

you're forgetting about

Both him and Smith are likely to be too expensive.

With Watson also chipping in with the ball ,don't think they should be playing 4 more quicks.

 

[Cevno]

Is having Xavier Doherty as your only spinner really any wiser a move?

Better than Relying on Smith as your spinner though.

And in recent times the likes of Yuvraj and Raina have been very useful in ODI cricket in India too.

 

[pup11]

I think Haddin is just going to prove to be a failure as an opener in the worldcup, because its pretty unrealistic to hope that he would come in after keeping for 50 overs in the sub-continent heat and then straight away contribute as an opener.
Haddin along with David Hussey are probably the two best attacking players of spin in our side, so they should be used in the middle order.
Clarke is going to be burden on the rest of the middle order batsmen, so he is better off opening and if nothing else that might atleast just make play a few shots.
I also said this in the game thread that better utilization of your players is very important, someone like Smith can prove to be a revelation with the ball in the sub-continent if he's trusted to do a job with the ball, but atm he is just being used as a slogger and partnership breaking part-timer which really makes no sense.

 

[Prince EWS]

I think Haddin is just going to prove to be a failure as an opener in the worldcup, because its pretty unrealistic to hope that he would come in after keeping for 50 overs in the sub-continent heat and then straight away contribute as an opener.
Haddin along with David Hussey are probably the two best attacking players of spin in our side, so they should be used in the middle order.
Clarke is going to be burden on the rest of the middle order batsmen, so he is better off opening and if nothing else that might atleast just make play a few shots.
I also said this in the game thread that better utilization of your players is very important, someone like Smith can prove to be a revelation with the ball in the sub-continent if he's trusted to do a job with the ball, but atm he is just being used as a slogger and partnership breaking part-timer which really makes no sense.

I disagree with everything you've said in this post.

 

[Cevno]

Haddin has actually done decently well in his stint as a opener overall.

 

[pup11]

Not denying the selection panel's decisions have been off at times. Just saying that Hilditch, as the chairman, is the biggest and most public target. Trevor Hohns was too and yet he's being sounded out to resume the spot if Hilditch steps down, despite he and his panel making almost as many bone-headed calls as the current lot. But, well, the team was winning so even the silly decisions could be justified on the basis that it didn't cost a match/series.

Point is that shuffling the deck won't solve all the on-field problems. They might not have been spanked by an innings x 3 but selecting Hauritz/Hodge/Khawaja/Doug for the whole series and dropping Hilf/Ponting/Clarke/Norf at various points of it is pretty unlikely to have prevented a solid series loss. Sure the selection team isn't always picking what I think is the best available combo of players but what is the best ain't that much better.

Ok mate, since the buck stops with a captain for failure of the side why should it be any different for chairman of selectors.
For me making a few mistakes while picking a team is not a big issue, but this selection panel have been outrageously poor as they have lacked any sort of vision or planning while selecting the Australian side, and the worse part is they just haven't shown any sort faith in any of their selections.
Its worth noting that pretty much every half decent player in the Oz domestic arena has represented Australian national side in one form or the other which is absolutely ridiculous and don't think they have any excuses to hide behind tbh.

 

[pup11]

I disagree with everything you've said in this post.

Well that's not something new...
Seriously though you are right when you say that we need to set the innings rolling while the ball is new, but any momentum that the openers create would be destroyed by Clarke the moment he comes into bat, by having Clarke opening we atleast ensure that he either plays a few shots and proves of some use or he just gets out early, either way he doesn't hurt the team much. It also is worth noting that Clarke has a pretty decent record while opening the batting.
In an ideal world I won't have guys like Clarke, Smith in the side, but since they are there its important that they are used in the best possible way.

 

[centurymaker]

Hauritz and Tait injured too now!

 

[TumTum]

I don't like Marsh opening in ODIs. I don't mind him down the order but he gets bogged down against the new ball unless he's trying to blast it T20 style.

Opening in ODIs:

		Mat	Inns	NO	Runs	HS	Ave	SR	100	50

Brad Haddin	30	30	1	984	110	33.93	85.04	2	5
Shaun Marsh	26	26	1	928	112	37.12	73.82	1	6

Marsh has the higher average, but Haddin's strike rate is much better and I feel it's really important to score runs off the new ball and take advantage of that first PP in the subcontinent. Batting just gets harder on slower pitches as the ball gets older and the spinners come on.

Haddin's also got to bat somewhere, and he really struggles to score against spin early in his innings, so I'd stay away from batting him in the middle order if I could avoid it.

I don't mind Marsh in the team if he comes in for Hussey but I'd bat him at six or so rather than open with him.

I was a critic of Marsh's slow early scoring as well, but he's probably in the form of his life atm.

But lets get something straight, Haddin is not an opening batsman and he isn't a batsman that will get the big score. He's always going to be a quick 30s dasher.

For me just bat Haddin at 7, so when he comes in he's forced to attack straight away, which is his game anyway.

 

[Johnners]

I disagree with everything you've ever said in these posts.

AWTA

Any word on how serious Tait's injury is? Do we get to replace him with a bowler that may actually be fit enough to bowl 10 overs?

 

[Sylvester]

Sounds like Tait will be okay, could be back for Sunday.

 

[pup11]

AWTA

Any word on how serious Tait's injury is? Do we get to replace him with a bowler that may actually be fit enough to bowl 10 overs?

Apart from Nannes is there really any viable option to replace Tait..??

 

[Sylvester]

Best to bring in Doherty if hes not already in the side for Hauritz. Then would be looking at Nannes although still don't know about all this pace on the subcontinent. Other option would be taking a punt on O'Keefe and hope he is better than his OD stats suggest. Siddle isn't ready for the shorter formats.

 

[howardj]

Re the make-up of our squad.

Been much made of Australia throwing its World Cup eggs in the pace bowling basket. There are a few points to note.

Firstly, to those who criticise the move based on the docile conditions that prevail on the subcontinent, I ask - are the pitches over there really any more docile than those served up in the Carribean in 2007? Tait starred at that World Cup.

Secondly, just because we've picked quite a few quicks, doesn't mean they'll all be in the First XI. I Given the susceiptibility of Johson, Lee and Tait to injury, it makes sense that we've got plenty of quicks in the squad should worse come to worse.

Finally, such is the dearth of spinners in Australia, our squad was always going to be lean on leather twirlers, and thus leather flingers were always going to figure heavily.