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Where do we go now?

theegyptian

International Vice-Captain
Discuss which way you think your nation (or any nation) should go now they have been knocked out of the T20 WC bearing in mind the next two tournaments are

2014 T20 WC, Bangladesh
2016 T20 WC, India
 

GIMH

Norwood's on Fire
The next two are in the subcontinent? Time to **** this hit and giggle **** off then :ph34r:
 

theegyptian

International Vice-Captain
From England's pov I think they have to continue down the path they have gone and continue to back most of the youngsters. Pietersen reintegrating back into the team will do wonders to the make up of the team and the rest of the players should benefit from the experience they have got through this WC.

Batting wise Wright has proved in this tournament he has improved immensely and deserves a prolonged spell at the top of the order. Pietersen and Morgan are class players at 3 and 5. Hales isn't convincing but he surpasssed my expectations this tournament and is a boundary hitter early on against pace. Buttler and Bairstow both have big issues but both are still young and talented and are integral to the fielding makeup of the team. Neither at this stage is a good enough WK to challenge for that spot and neither will be unless they have a prolonged spell as WK in county cricket and both are going to have limited opportunities to do this unless something changes.

Bopara is a mess emotionally and surely will get a prolonged break from the england team. He never was a particularly good bat in T20 cricket but his bowling is useful.

Kieswetter surely is destined for a long break from england colours. You don't drop your WK half way through the WC to bring him back next match. I feel Kieswetter will come again for England and still make it - just not for a few years.

As for wicketkeeper i have no idea where you go given what i have written. Prior has been tried and failed and personally i prefer him as a test only selection where he remains fit and focused. If he comes back to ODI and T20 I feel like he'll have to be superfit to maintain his current test performances behind the stumps and as a batsman with no guarantee he's going to be good at T20. Maybe Chris Read or James Foster who have been continually excellent in county cricket and bat them at 7 or 8 or hope that one of Bairstow, Buttler, Billings starts keeping regularly in county cricket but a good wicketkeeper isn't made over a couple of years. With the next two T20 WC's being in Asia maybe Prior is the best option given the current ages of Read(34) and Foster(32)

Of the bowlers I think they have the right group of bowlers. Finn is very good. I still feel Dernbach should be persevered with. He's erratic but talented and is very different to anything else we have in England. Broad, Bresnan and Swann are fine going forward. Briggs was unfortunate this tournament not to play more but i feel like his lack of batting skills are behind this. Rafiq may come into things long term. They could do with a left armer pacer and there are a few around but none too close to selection. (Mills, Topley, Willey)

IPL contracts are an iffy situation for the younger english players like Hales, Kieswetter, Buttler, Bairstow.... Basically they could really benefit from a few seasons of IPL in terms of their T20 and subcontinent experience. The problem is that the IPL comes at preseason and then the start of the English first class season and for any player hoping to make it in the longer formats this is a no-no in terms of their career prospects. England players in the past have overvalued themselves in the IPL auctions and subsequently and correctly being overlooked by Indian franchises. Some of the guys listed above could do worse than putting themselves available at $25000 or $50000 and getting some experience of IPL cricket.
 

Viscount Tom

International Debutant
Prior really shouldn't be wasted in LO I'd genuinely rather preserve him for tests. Would actually willingly tick with Kieswetter at this stage and hope he improves on the Lions tour.
Bairstow I feel needs work in LO its not his best format set.

Buttler I think needs work he's not played enough and tbf he did come unstuck against quality bowling when we've seen him thus far.
 

Cabinet96

Global Moderator
For England - I wouldn't feel the need to make too many changes tbh. Much of the team that played this tournament were in their first year of international cricket. This tournament will have been a learning curve, and hopefully they'll all come back as better players in Bangladesh in two years.
 

BackFootPunch

International 12th Man
Right so with the next couple of World Cups in the SC we can basically build a team for those conditions that won't get spanked everywhere else too.

Out:
Vettori, Oram and Mills are done. Honestly wouldn't be worried if all three announce their retirement from all forms of the game tomorrow. Nicol can go too.

Still here:
B. McCullum - Yep, stick round son, will only be mid-30s for the next 2 tournies.
Guptill - stop getting out so softly you ****, we need more.
Taylor - see Mccullum, B.
Franko - same as Ross and BMac.
Williamson - few more years of experience and will hopefully have a bit more power by then.
N. McCullum - should make the next tournament at least; our best bowler in this format imo.
Southee - Young, (generally) good, keep working on the batting.
Bracewell - Same as Southee, but please let's not **** up his test bowling.
Milne - Potential. He'll get it sorted by the next WC imo.
Hira - Showed enough last night to let us stick with him, gun fielder too.
Watling - Loves cricket, always need a man like him. Also looked quite good in Windies but never got a shot here.

In:
Neesham - Get him in there.
Latham - Definite chance, same situation at Williamson really; needs to add some more power options and work on rotating strike against spin.
Sodhi - Will be very interesting to see how he goes in domestic cricket over the next season or 2.
Ryder - Please get your **** sorted, big fella.


Ideal team going forward:

Guptill
Ryder
McCullum
Taylor
Franklin
Williamson
Neesham
NcCullum
Southee
Hira
Milne (or Bracewell if we really need him)
 

Scaly piscine

Cricket Web: All-Time Legend
Why do people group ODIs and T20Is together?

Prior could definitely be an asset in T20Is, he just happens to be useless in ODIs. Dhoni is incredible at ODIs and useless in T20Is. They're very different formats. I'd have no problem with Prior playing in T20s for England, the standard of wicket-keeping would go up massively for a start.

I don't think there will be huge changes for England, something like:

Hales
Keeper (Prior or whoever, doesn't matter a great deal and they can go lower in the order)
KP
Wright
Morgan
Buttler
Bresnan
Swann
Broad
Finn
Left-arm spinner


I think the batting is the hardest to predict, someone like Stokes could certainly break into it if he makes the mental adjustment and something clicks - his bowling and the fact he bats left-handed would fit into the side nicely. But he's just talent at this stage, his T20 record is rubbish.
 

Spark

Global Moderator
I suspect we'll do our usual thing of losing a hilarious number of T20s after the WC is over, moving to a new specialist captain then doing waaaay better than anyone expected at the WC.
 

Howsie

International Captain
GIVE YOUR BEST BATSMEN THE MOST CHANCE TO SUCCEED. McCullum needs to open and Taylor should be batting at three, as a team you're severely handicapping yourself if you don't do that. Just look at Australia, Sri Lanka and the West Indies for example, they realise this and look at how they've gone this tournament.

I can't stress how much we need to get rid of Jacob Oram either, the **** is seriously useless. Averaged about five with the bat, went at 9.5 with the ball and was an absolute liability in the field. Bits & Pieces players just like any other form of the game are next to useless in 20/20.
 

Kippax

International Captain
Ideal team going forward:

Guptill
Ryder
McCullum
Taylor
Franklin
Williamson
Neesham
NcCullum
Southee
Hira
Milne (or Bracewell if we really need him)
Few would be happier than me to see a former CW poster > CDG, despite Wells relaying 'Neeshisms' on Twitter, portraying him as an equally dopey ****. :p Career HS of 39, 87 runs total in last year's HRV, he really needs to ask Otago for more opportunity than that this year. Even right at the top post-Cumming.

Also definite room for Matt Henry in my XI if he's the same or better post-surgery.
 

ankitj

International Coach
Need to make bold changes. I think this format requires that more than the longer versions. You can't keep carrying players in poor form for too long. They can hurt the team big in matches that last only 20 overs. We should have been bold enough to replace Gambhir or Rohit with Tiwary.

Besides, captains - all of them - should stop "saving" players in T20s. Raina, ABD, Taylor, Akmal, they all played too low in different games. This pisses me off most when I watch T20s.
 

ankitj

International Coach
Actually, if you think about it, none of that is really "bold", it's just common sense. Do captains' brains freeze when making decisions in T20's?
 

Arjun

Cricketer Of The Year
The Indians should take T20 seriously, and play accordingly. They seem completely misfit in T20- almost like they were in Tests in England and Australia lately. I'd prefer to see players good enough for T20 playing T20Is for India- and the likes of Tiwary, Harbhajan and Chawla don't count. Ideally, a completely different team for T20 is needed for India, for the next two years, but I don't mind having a few blokes not established in Tests (Rohit, Gambhir, Irfan, Mishra) being T20I regulars. Dhoni should quit T20Is for good, and concentrate on fixing his Test batting and keeping.

And get rid of Duncan Fletcher. We've had enough of failure under this has-been.
 

LegendaryProtea

School Boy/Girl Captain
Aside from Steyn, Robin Petersen, Duminy and Faf, everyone has come out of this debacle looking terrible. I don't even know where to begin.

Firstly, questions need to be asked about AB's captaincy. Very poor team selection (e.g. keeping Levi in the side for so long), poor batting orders, bowling the wrong bowlers at the wrong time etc. I don't know what part the team management had in the first two but whoever it was has to be held responsible because opening with Levi in 2 super-8 matches and batting AB at 6 is just shambolic. Also, AB's batting form has taken a nosedive since the start of the England tour and I don't really know whether he is cut out to be captain, keeper and pivotal batsman.

Secondly, I don't want to see Levi in international cricket ever again. This pathetic excuse for an opening batsman pretty much guaranteed we were one down before the match ever began, putting pressure on those coming in from virtually the first over. He needs to learn to bat properly and develop his offside play and and in the absence of noticeable improvements, his international career is effectively over.

If the team are insistent on not playing Albie Morkel then please don't replace him with Mr. I-Got-Smacked-For-32-Runs-In-An-Over. Wayne Parnell is regressing at an astonishing rate, it's actually embarrassing to witness his decline from an all-rounder of immense promise into the depths of mediocrity. If the team are insistent on playing Albie then bat him at 3 or 4 and not at 7 or 8 when he has 3 balls to make an impact. Also, if you play him then he must play as an out-and-out batsman because his bowling simply isn't international standard.

Amla and Kallis in the same side isn't working out. Both bat too slow and don't work together in the top 3. I feel Kallis was brought back for his experience and bowling ability mainly and I doubt we'll see him in T20I cricket again. Botha leaves now and we need another spinner to replace him for the 2014 T20I WC and I'm thinking Prenelan Subrayen who is a similar type of bowler.

Finally, what the hell is Behardien doing in this squad over the likes of Miller and Ingram? It's one thing if you have absolutely no talented batsmen and you're selecting the best of the worst but Miller is a gun T20 batsman with a fantastic record and to see him miss out to a limited batsman like Behardien speaks to the muddled thinking of the selectors.

All things considered, it's been a hopeless display and everyone needs to get their act together. This simply is not acceptable. I'm sure we'll continue to be there or thereabouts in ODIs and I feel we have a strong enough team to be no.1 in Tests for a considerable period of time but these types of brain-fades in major tournaments needs to be rectified quickly.
 

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