What is a home-track bully to you?

[Johan]

so I was having this conversation with @Coronis, and we seemed to have different definitions of a HTB

My definition – I think a player is a HTB when their "bullying" IE performance and excellence only manifests at home and not away from home. For example, If someone averages 70 at home and 50 away, I would not consider them a HTB because they are excellent both ways even if the degree is different for home and away. But if someone averages 70 at home and 35 away, then clearly, they are condition reliant and need their home pitches to be excellent in any relevant capacity, Examples – Jayawerdene, Warner and such. IE, Home pitches being needed to achieve excellent results.

The Other – The other interpretation is that HTB is someone where their performance has a big disparity home to away, under this, they cite Ponting, Lara, Pollock and such as Home track bullies as their averages are substantially higher at home than away from home, but obviously, as anyone would know, those three have excellent performance in most away countries too (bar India for Ponting), under this if someone averages 70 at home and 50 abroad they are still a HTB due to the disparity in home and away performances, Examples – Pollock, Lara, Kohli and such, IE, overseas performance being lower than Home regardless of how good overseas performance is.

 

[capt_Luffy]

Think first definition fits my perception better, but it's more nuanced.

 

[sayon basak]

First, define "home". Why is England Pietersen's home?

 

[Johan]

First, define "home". Why is England Pietersen's home?

because he chose to play for England.

 

[sayon basak]

because he chose to play for England.

Does free will really exist?

 

[Randomfan]

Some one who can bully at home.

Example: Anderson, Broad, Jayawardene, Ponting, Waqar , Kane, Jadeja, Ashwin, Lara, IK

There is nothing wrong in being HTB. Every team needs them because you play half of your games at home.

 

[andruid]

Does free will really exist?

It was pre-destined to exist....


Anyway Marnus Labuschagne

 

[sayon basak]

Some one who can bully at home.

Example: Anderson, Broad, Jayawardene, Ponting, Waqar , Kane, Jadeja, Ashwin, Lara, IK

There is nothing wrong in being HTB. Every team needs them because you play half of your games at home.

@capt_Luffy

 

[GIMH]

It’s someone like David Warner who has godlike numbers at home and is a 2nd XI club cricketer away

 

[Thala_0710]

It's the first one of course. Lara and Punter are not home bullies... They are just bullies in general who are better at home

 

[Fuller Pilch]

It’s someone like James Anderson who has godlike numbers at home and is a 2nd XI club cricketer away

Good example

 

[Thala_0710]

Away bullies though are much more fun and rare.... Who are the biggest away bullies in history?
The first name in my mind is Amarnath who avgs 52 away and 30 at home

 

[Fuller Pilch]

Ajaz Patel is the greatest away track bully in history.

 

[Thala_0710]

Ajaz Patel is the greatest away track bully in history.

We'll he's much better away.... But he's not really a bully (except Wankhede)

 

[Thala_0710]

At Wankhede:
2 mat 25 wkts @15.4
Rest of the career:
19 mat 60 wkts @35
It's absurd really

 

[capt_Luffy]

It's the first one of course. Lara and Punter are not home bullies... They are just bullies in general who are better at home

Sandeep Patil another good shout. 47+ away, 27- home

 

[Johan]

Good example

miles better than every kiwi pacer this century btw

 

[MasterBlaster24]

Away bullies though are much more fun and rare.... Who are the biggest away bullies in history?
The first name in my mind is Amarnath who avgs 52 away and 30 at home

Chris Broad is the first name that comes to my mind. Stephen Fleming is another—he could’ve had a much better Test career if his home conditions weren’t New Zealand, where he really struggled. Darren Bravo is a more recent example who often looked more comfortable away from home. Then there’s Wally Hammond—not just an away-track bully, but he averaged 61 in away Ashes compared to 37 at home.

Honourable mentions: Ken Barrington, who wasn’t just great away but arguably the best away batter after Bradman. And Alan Knott, not a standout batter, but still averaged 42 away vs 26 at home. Says a lot.

 

[Johan]

Honourable mentions: Ken Barrington, who wasn’t just great away but arguably the best away batter after Bradman. And Alan Knott, not a standout batter, but still averaged 42 away vs 26 at home. Says a lot.

I reckon you'd find this to be a theme with English batters from 1960s and 1970s, abroad were roads other than New Zealand which usually didn't have the attack to oppose good units, Australia and West Indies specifically were proper roads and home just happened to be the only lively place in world, and not lively in minefield context either, lively in 2000s South Africa context.

Ted Dexter averaged 53 abroad, 43 at home. Ken Barrington as you said yourself, between 1959 and 1969, Colin Cowdrey averaged 59 abroad while 41 at home, Alan Knott as you said, Geoffrey was averaging 55+ away from home before the 1978-79 Ashes, which happened to have the spiciest pitches in Australian Cricket since 1880s.

 

[MasterBlaster24]

I reckon you'd find this to be a theme with English batters from 1960s and 1970s, abroad were roads other than New Zealand which usually didn't have tYep;;attack to oppose good units, Australia and West Indies specifically were proper roads and home just happened to be the only lively place in world, and not lively in minefield context either, lively in 2000s South Africa context.

Ted Dexter averaged 53 abroad, 43 at home. Ken Barrington as you said yourself, between 1959 and 1969, Colin Cowdrey averaged 59 abroad while 41 at home, Alan Knott as you said, Geoffrey was averaging 55+ away from home before the 1978-79 Ashes, which happened to have the spiciest pitches in Australian Cricket since 1880s.

Yep, you're right.