The Ashes won't be close

[tooextracool]

I think Bell would go in at 3rd or 4th - remember the catch he took at the Oval?

indeed, but thats assuming he actually plays, again something that probably wont happen.

 

[tooextracool]

No, it's not - who apart from Vaughan did (Butcher's average of 31 for that series was extremely flattering, he was dropped at least 5 times in the First and Fifth Tests)?
Butcher, unlike most players, has had a single good series against Australia.
Who else has?
Thorpe and Vaughan.

which changes the fact that hes been nothing special against australia how?
just because one bangladesh batsman did better than the rest of them in australia, it doesnt mean either of them are particularly brilliant. and really, that last ashes side was filled with injury hit players and more than half the players who did play arent even in the side.

 

[tooextracool]

31* on a raging turner wasn't a bad innings..

nor is it anything good, especially considering that the quality of spinners that SA have, with bradman spearheading the attack. he had 2 good innings thats it.

Thorpe was exceptionally poor most of the time, yes, but quite simply he had it coming - he couldn't go on averaging 61 forever..

again, how does it change the fact that he underperformed?

Yep, and he probably always will look to - but he needs to start producing it soon, he can't expect many more chances.
And Butcher is undoubtedly the better player at present.

hardly so, hes undoubtedly the more experienced proven no 3 present, but given that hes had a history of brain damage everytime he crosses 50 and the fact that he makes nehra look like a good fielder, im fairly certain id be at least looking for someone else for the ashes.

Yet the South African bowlers, none of whom played the whole series are anything amazing, certainly showed he wasn't as good as he was against New Zealand and West Indies.

and yet he hammered the same attack into oblivion during the summer of 2003 at home.

 

[tooextracool]

Since his recall he has, yes, but he used to be a far better catcher than he has been recently.

again, how does this bare any relevance to the ashes series that will be taking place this summer?

 

[tooextracool]

And people who have, too.

in which case they can be described as 'extremely stupid' and should give up watching cricket.

 

[tooextracool]

And you are insane to suggest giles is a better bowler than mcgill. Mcgill takes lots of wickets and his international carrer proves that.
If warne wasn't around mcgill would get more games would be one of the best spinners around imo.

if warne wasnt around, hed be exposed as being the very ordinary bowler that he is, as his record in games without warne would suggest.

 

[Scallywag]

if warne wasnt around, hed be exposed as being the very ordinary bowler that he is, as his record in games without warne would suggest.

If means nothing. If MacGill was English he would be their best spinner.

MacGill is a class bowler who has had to play second fiddle to Warne which takes nothing away from his ability.

 

[tooextracool]

If means nothing. If MacGill was English he would be their best spinner.

he probably would, but that would only suggest how poor the quality of spinners in england are

MacGill is a class bowler who has had to play second fiddle to Warne which takes nothing away from his ability.

no, the only reason hes actually succeeded is because hes had to play 2nd fiddle to warne, otherwise he wouldnt have got to play on any of those spinner friendly wickets that he gets constantly picked for. and his average without warne only proves the point further.

 

[C_C]

McGill has good stats...primrily because he bowls to teams who got no clue about playing spin.
His record against good spin players is hopeless
50 average against IND....46 against SL and 31 vs WI....

About the only thing he can do is get real good turn...as good as anyone....but when it comes to loop, variation, dip and accuracy, he is closer to tendulkar than he is to a full time spinner.

 

[Scallywag]

McGill has good stats...primrily because he bowls to teams who got no clue about playing spin.
His record against good spin players is hopeless
50 average against IND....46 against SL and 31 vs WI....

About the only thing he can do is get real good turn...as good as anyone....but when it comes to loop, variation, dip and accuracy, he is closer to tendulkar than he is to a full time spinner.

So the teams that play spin well like England who Kumble averages 30 against MacGill only aves 24, or South Africa where Kumble aves 31 compared to MacGills 25.

So why does a cl*** spinner like Kumble have such a high average against these teams while MacGill has a lower average.

In fact if you look at Kumble he averages over 40 in Aus, Eng, NZ and Sri lanka so its not a good idea to use selective stats against spinners.

 

[tooextracool]

McGill has good stats...primrily because he bowls to teams who got no clue about playing spin.

you need to get rid of the idea that any team you choose are poor players of spin. england and SA have won test series in the sub continent, so they're more than capable of playing spin.

 

[LongHopCassidy]

How is "class" getting asterisked out all the time?

 

[tooextracool]

because it also contains the letters 'a ss'

 

[Tom Halsey]

"MacGill is quite capable of being every bit as poor as anyone England might call-up to back-up Giles"

He is capable of taking a lot of wickets too, on a turning pitch

As is Giles.

 

[Tom Halsey]

Mcgill does bowl some rubbish sometimes but there is no doubt he is more dangerous than giles and Any team would pick mcgill over giles.
It doesn't matter in tests how you bowl, its how many wickets you get for how many runs

More dangerous than Giles, more runs conceded than Giles. I don’t think there’s an obvious pick between the two of them.

 

[Tom Halsey]

Croft's record shows he is far inferior.

His Test record doesn’t. Giles is better now, but having watched them, I think Croft at his best was probably about the same as Giles now.

 

[Tom Halsey]

How is "class" getting asterisked out all the time?

I wonder…

That said, I think there needs to be a change there, it’s happening a lot.

 

[Tom Halsey]

If means nothing. If MacGill was English he would be their best spinner.

MacGill is a class bowler who has had to play second fiddle to Warne which takes nothing away from his ability.

Yes but without Warne’s help at the other end, his record is very ordinary. That’s also partly because without Warne in the side, that means he has to play on non-turning pitches too, as Warne isn’t there, and it’s there he gets found out.

 

[Tom Halsey]

you need to get rid of the idea that any team you choose are poor players of spin. england and SA have won test series in the sub continent, so they're more than capable of playing spin.

That may be true now, but at the time when MacGill played England (98/99), England were incredibly poor players of spin.

 

[sledger]

That may be true now, but at the time when MacGill played England (98/99), England were incredibly poor players of spin.

well even now they are by no means brilliant are they? i dont think a tremendous deal has happened since then, england have improved no doubt, but with players like trescothick who dont move their feet they will still struggle against spin.