Poll: Who do you think will win the 2019 World Cup?

[Singh767]

The two Indian spinners you're referring to are both risky wristspinners and are prone to often having an off-day (unlike Pak pace unit). Plus they can't bat or field (unlike Jadeja, who should be in the team but probably won't).

But with Bhuvi being at number 8 that is enough batting, also the amount of times Indias tail has to bat in an ODI is limited - limited to the point that Kuldeep, Chahal and Bumrah's batting should not be considered in their selection

 

[weldone]

But with Bhuvi being at number 8 that is enough batting, also the amount of times Indias tail has to bat in an ODI is limited - limited to the point that Kuldeep, Chahal and Bumrah's batting should not be considered in their selection

Given the mediocrity of India's lower-middle order (Dhoni included), Jadeja would be ideal at no. 8 imo. Also, don't forget that he's India's all-time best fielder.

 

[srbhkshk]

The two Indian spinners you're referring to are both risky wristspinners and are prone to often having an off-day (unlike Pak pace unit). Plus they can't bat or field (unlike Jadeja, who should be in the team but probably won't).

Jadeja wouldn't have gotten India a series win in SA in a million years.

 

[weldone]

Jadeja wouldn't have gotten India a series win in SA in a million years.

Maybe. But what I am saying is that the two wristspinner strategy is a risky one - on some days they'd really impress and on other days they'd be off the mark - hope such a day doesn't come in WC semifinal. Ideally I'd want to see one of the wristspinners (Kuldeep) with Jadeja. That will be a balanced and safer attack - and will also strengthen batting and fielding.

 

[srbhkshk]

Maybe. But what I am saying is that the two wristspinner strategy is a risky one - on some days they'd really impress and on other days they'd be off the mark - hope such a day doesn't come in WC semifinal. Ideally I'd want to see one of the wristspinners (Kuldeep) with Jadeja. That will be a balanced and safer attack - and will also strengthen batting and fielding.

See, your point about Batting and Fielding is well taken , but -
1. Kuldeep actually fills the accurate role decently enough - yes he is never going to be Jadeja level accurate, but he has very very rarely been thumped around in IPL. Chahal is not that good but I'd say he is also fairly accurate by wrist spin standards.
2. Jadeja himself often used to get thrashed big time when the batsman lined him up.

I wouldn't mind Jadeja over Chahal, but I don't think it's enormous incremental value, especially against a team like England where you really need a bit of magic in the bowling department.

 

[straw man]

At the last Champions Trophy in England, NZ had an excellent top 4 and a very good all-conditions bowling attack, albeit one that wasn't best-suited to 350-par roads. However the batting was also horrible from number 5 down and that killed the side.

Fast-forward to now and the strengths and weakness are... exactly the same. Maybe a very slight improvement with Latham and De Grandhomme in the middle order, if we're being generous. Need one to two good new batsmen/all-rounders in those middle spots to be competitive in England, especially if everyone else is scoring 100 off the last ten overs.

 

[Daemon]

Maybe. But what I am saying is that the two wristspinner strategy is a risky one - on some days they'd really impress and on other days they'd be off the mark - hope such a day doesn't come in WC semifinal. Ideally I'd want to see one of the wristspinners (Kuldeep) with Jadeja. That will be a balanced and safer attack - and will also strengthen batting and fielding.

On the surface it makes sense to think of Jadeja as the safer option but the numbers don't really back this up imo. Jadeja ****s the bed more often than Chahal and probably only slightly less than Kuldeep, all while putting in significantly fewer match winning spells.

 

[harsh.ag]

If one of the spinners is to be dropped, it should be for a pacer imo. Bhuvi and Bumrah are locks if fit. So, either Shami or Umesh could come in.

 

[vcs]

Bhuvi shouldn't be a lock in ODIs at all.

 

[harsh.ag]

Bhuvi shouldn't be a lock in ODIs at all.

But he is, right?

 

[vcs]

Yeah, the management seems to think so. His ODI record isn't all that good TBH.

 

[OverratedSanity]

Yeah, the management seems to think so. His ODI record isn't all that good TBH.

And they find excuses to drop him from the test side.

This team is run completely ass backwards.

 

[Fuller Pilch]

At the last Champions Trophy in England, NZ had an excellent top 4 and a very good all-conditions bowling attack, albeit one that wasn't best-suited to 350-par roads. However the batting was also horrible from number 5 down and that killed the side.

Fast-forward to now and the strengths and weakness are... exactly the same. Maybe a very slight improvement with Latham and De Grandhomme in the middle order, if we're being generous. Need one to two good new batsmen/all-rounders in those middle spots to be competitive in England, especially if everyone else is scoring 100 off the last ten overs.

If Phillips can perform in ODIs like he did in CPL I'd like to see Munro as a finisher. Good to see Corey Anderson's batting form in the T20 blast and the way Santner batted v England in the ODIs last summer

 

[Flem274*]

after seeing phillips against a proper bowling attack (pakistan) i'm not leaping on the hype train. amir was all over him.

 

[Black_Warrior]

Bhuvi shouldn't be a lock in ODIs at all.

WTF? Why?
Guy was going under 4 an over when the rest of the Indian attack was getting torn apart in the CT final.

He is an excellent LO bowler and even if his average is not quite there yet, his economy rates in PPs and death overs has been excellent in the last 2 years or so

 

[Daemon]

His death bowling has been pretty good but he has been carted a fair bit at times iirc.

Shami hasn't played ODIs a lot recently has he?

 

[Black_Warrior]

^ That could be said for pretty much any bowler in LO cricket today. Even Starc got carted around by England in the 1-4 loss earlier this year.

 

[weldone]

Nah, Bhuvi seems much better than he is, because of Bumrah.

Often you'll hear the commentators say that the Indian pacers are doing well in the powerplay or in the death overs and after looking at the scorecard you'll see the one who's really doing well is Bumrah with 10-1-47-2 while Bhuvi is sort of free-riding with 10-0-59-1 (just imagine how bad that 10-0-59-1 would look when the bowling partner also goes for the same).
There are exceptions in some matches, but most of the matches go like this.

Shami is still a better option than Bhuvi imo - he needs to get a full series.

 

[FBU]

Final
Pakistan v N Zealand

 

[SteveNZ]

Final
Pakistan v N Zealand

Reckon our lack of death prowess will ensure that doesn't happen. Very little death hitting prowess (although Corey Anderson's English T20 form is promising) and death bowling also a major weakness - Southee is capable but has been a custard ODI performer for a long while now (hasn't averaged under 30 with the ball in a calendar year since 2011).

If it's a tournament where you need to score 320+, can't see us coming near it (unless our big 3 of Ross, Kane and Gup absolutely gun it) And our 4th/5th/6th bowling options are absolutely threadbare.

I agree with Fuller Pitch (although not on Phillips yet), I'd like to see Latham open given he had success there for Durham in the T20s, allowing Manu to bat at 6. The Munro experiment at the top didn't work in ODIs last summer at all. Good bowling completely got on top of him, the Basin ODI v Pakistan apart. Latham had his moments in the middle order last summer but I think our comparative advantage is greater with him opening than batting 5, where he sort of sits as a revival agent rather than a finisher - which you'd like your 5 to be.

Something like Latham Guptill Williamson Taylor Anderson Munro de Grandhomme Santner Southee Boult Sodhi/Milne/Ferguson would be my XI this far out.