• Welcome to the Cricket Web forums, one of the biggest forums in the world dedicated to cricket.

    You are currently viewing our boards as a guest which gives you limited access to view most discussions and access our other features. By joining our free community you will have access to post topics, respond to polls, upload content and access many other special features. Registration is fast, simple and absolutely free so please, join the Cricket Web community today!

    If you have any problems with the registration process or your account login, please contact us.

***Official*** South Africa in New Zealand 2017

SeamUp

International Coach
At the best of times I am anti-Firdose but there is a possibility for us calling for another spinner and it is also reported in NZL press. If we 0-1 down and get the pitch we got in the ODI's at Hamilton there is every chance they will call for another spinner.
 

StephenZA

International Coach
Possible that they would want an extra spinner in the squad (was surprised when we did not take a 2nd spinner), but I cannot see us dropping any of Morkel/Philander/Rabada for that spinner. The pitches are not turning enough for the first 3 days to say that one of Piedt/Shamsi/Tahir will be better than say Morkel with a newish ball and/or a reversing ball later. About the only way I can see us doing this is if we drop Duminy and bring in Parnell/Morris thus allowing us to drop Morkel still have 3 seamer`s and play an extra spinner. For me these wickets are slower and turn a bit more but have been no different from playing at St Georges in PE and can`t remember us ever playing 2 spinners then. Still think this is people trying to make non-existent news.
 

Marius

State Captain
Possible that they would want an extra spinner in the squad (was surprised when we did not take a 2nd spinner), but I cannot see us dropping any of Morkel/Philander/Rabada for that spinner. The pitches are not turning enough for the first 3 days to say that one of Piedt/Shamsi/Tahir will be better than say Morkel with a newish ball and/or a reversing ball later. About the only way I can see us doing this is if we drop Duminy and bring in Parnell/Morris thus allowing us to drop Morkel still have 3 seamer`s and play an extra spinner. For me these wickets are slower and turn a bit more but have been no different from playing at St Georges in PE and can`t remember us ever playing 2 spinners then. Still think this is people trying to make non-existent news.
Exactly.

The only times we've played a Test match where two frontline spinners have taken wickets in wins have been against Bangladesh (I'm open to correction though).

The times we've won in India, Pakistan, SL, etc have all been with one spinner. I really find it hard to believe we'll drop one of the seamers to find space for an extra spinner.
 

SeamUp

International Coach
Well according to AB only Nagpur has spun more...

If there was no reverse at Dunedin it would have made matters worse for us. We a team that has always loved getting our wickets caught behind the wicket and we not going to get that a lot in this test series (bar maybe Wellington). Just say there was no bounce at Hamilton and no side-ways movement and we get the same sort of pitch at Hamilton as ODI's and NZL play two spinners I would say they have the preferred attack from what I saw of that pitch.
 
Last edited:

StephenZA

International Coach
Well according to AB only Nagpur has spun more...
Think it shows he has spent to long outta the game to be making such comments...

And I have not seen us not reverse the ball on a dry pitch in a long time..... think dark arts have been passed on (#suckergate)
 

SeamUp

International Coach
Think it shows he has spent to long outta the game to be making such comments...

And I have not seen us not reverse the ball on a dry pitch in a long time..... think dark arts have been passed on (#suckergate)
I don't know so much. The ball was turning really square for the finger spinners. Real eye-opener.

New Zealand clearly making a conscious effort for home-advantage to them and I'm all for that. NZL pitches used to be nightmare to play on for teams like ourselves with the lack of pace and bounce.

Interesting snip-bit for Hamilton test.

That said‚ the New Zealanders do not leave everything to geography and chance.

One half of the block at Seddon Park in Hamilton‚ where the third Test starts on March 25‚ has been laid with clay from a village 50km from Auckland called Patumahoe. Those pitches tend to be faster and more bouncy.

The English translation of the place’s Maori name could be rendered as "to kill with a club made of mahoe wood".

The other half of the pitch block features clay from the Canterbury hamlet of Waikari — "muddy waters" — which delivers slower‚ turning surfaces.

Unsurprisingly‚ the pitch for the third Test will be on the Waikari side of the block.
 

SeamUp

International Coach
Kepler's blog. Nice little rumour in the last paragraph.

Proteas showed winning class

One of the things about being a winning test team is to compete successfully in foreign conditions. The surface that South Africa played New Zealand on in Dunedin was about as far removed from a typical South African surface that one can find anywhere. The pitch was low and slow, and run scoring was difficult. It was easy enough to survive but scoring at a decent rate was just about impossible. The way South Africa adapted to these conditions was commendable.

Dean Elgar's man-of-the-match performance was an excellent one by a player who is evolving into a very good opening batsman for South Africa. Elgar has plenty of guts and excellent powers of concentration and as his confidence grows at this level he is becoming more and more valuable to the Proteas cause.

From a bowling point of view, the South African quicker bowlers had little to work with during this match. After the initial session on day one, when the Kiwis bowled and the ball moved around off the seam and also through the air, bowling became a war of attrition. Apart from the surface itself the weather was freezing cold for much of the test and required further adjustment. It was like playing test cricket in mid-winter back home in South Africa, particularly on day four.

The spinners, as expected, were in the game. That was what the surface was designed for. The Black Caps have a healthy respect for Vernon Philander. This is no surprise because Philander has been brilliant against them over the years. They are scared of producing a surface that has something in it for Philander to exploit. That is why they are leaning towards these slow turning pitches.

The problem for the Black Caps is that when they produce these slow, low surfaces they don't give themselves a chance of winning either. They will find it difficult to bowl South Africa out twice on these benign pitches. In fact, in Dunedin, had the final day not rained out, the Proteas may well have bowled New Zealand out on that last day.

The Kiwis may as well leave something in the surface in an effort to bring the two teams closer together. At least that way they will give their pace bowlers an even chance of success and give South Africa something to think about. The current strategy of hoping for two draws and preparing a dust bowl in Hamilton for the final tests could backfire on them.

There has been a lot of rain all over New Zealand for the last week, including here in Wellington where the next test starts on Thursday. Even though the Black Caps are looking forward to another flat surface it may not quite work out that way. There will be more pace and bounce in this pitch, which will please the Proteas and ensure a faster scoring rate.

This will also be a problem for the frail New Zealand batting line up. Other than their captain Kane Williamson, who is a brilliant player, the absence now of the injured Ross Taylor will weaken them severely. Williamson is always under pressure to hold the batting line up together, and now with Ross Taylor not there this pressure will intensify.

The New Zealand captain can't do it every time for his team and sooner or later the Proteas will dismiss him cheaply and the frailty of the New Zealand batting line up will be exposed.

On the bowling front, the Black Caps are hoping that Trent Boult will be fit for the next test. He has a groin strain and at this point it is unlikely that he will play. Due to the fact that New Zealand only played two specialist seamers in that first test they over-bowled both Trent Boult and Neil Wagner, which led to the Boult injury.

I still think that sustained pressure from South Africa will lead to success in this series. It will be good if they win here in Wellington because the way things are shaping up the last test in Hamilton could be a shoot out on a spin top.
 

StephenZA

International Coach
We shall see... I don`t think that these pitches will have puffs of dust coming out of them day 1 or 2... maybe day 3-4. Dry and slow, little seam movement and we will be relying on swing/reverse swing. But if Maharaj (who did not bowl his best) gets into the game think he will do well for us and there is always the Elgar hand grenades.
 

SeamUp

International Coach
We shall see... I don`t think that these pitches will have puffs of dust coming out of them day 1 or 2... maybe day 3-4. Dry and slow, little seam movement and we will be relying on swing/reverse swing. But if Maharaj (who did not bowl his best) gets into the game think he will do well for us and there is always the Elgar hand grenades.
Of course.

Just think you should always keep your options open.

I think they didn't keep back Shamsi/Tahir because they not quite sure who to pick. Considering the finger spinners out-bowled our wrist spinners on that wicket.Piedt may come into the reckoning and thank goodness his batting looks to have gone to a new level.
 

SteveNZ

International Captain
Hear, bloody hear. Dunedin weather-bashing is so ****ing tedious. Never mind the outright lie from veganbob.
It's pure bad luck. I was at the 2012 Dunedin Test, the two days in warm-ups were beautifully sunny. So you've had a Test there where it was 1 day out from being untouched by rain. Same thing here. And 2013 v England was unaffected, right? Ignoring my dunce North Pole comment, there's this silly feeling - quite possibly from North Islanders - that the South is blanketed by cold and rain 90% of the time and is unfit to hold cricket matches until they get a covered oval as well. Uni Oval is a ripping place to watch cricket, easy stroll from town, and deserves to be on the calendar.
 

veganbob

U19 Vice-Captain
With the amount of rain we've had the last few days, plus meh weather for the next few days , we might accidentally get an interesting pitch for the Wellington test.

The game might be watchable.

Although never underestimate modern drainage's ability to make cricket pitches boring, if desired, regardless of the weather.


Basin Reserve pitch 'hasn't seen daylight since last Friday' as big wet plays havoc with second test preparation | Stuff.co.nz



Hasn't seen daylight for 4 days.

Why would you want a pitch that the South Africans would destroy us in though? We would not last 3 days if it moves around.

The pitch like the last 1 is our best hope. It also served up a very good test match.
 

Immenso

International Debutant
Why would you want a pitch that the South Africans would destroy us in though? We would not last 3 days if it moves around.

The pitch like the last 1 is our best hope. It also served up a very good test match.
Because I've lost so much respect for this team, that I don't want them hiding behind a benign pitch to hide their flaws.

I was ok with this approach in 2011 v SAF (one of the best teams to visit our shores). I was also ok with this approach the following year v ENG, who I thought were awesome but in hindsight were there for the taking.

At that time we were a team on the improve ,but still with warknesses, and biding our time against some of the best seamed sensible.

Now? We can't select, coach, bat, bowl, catch, arrange proper fielding positions, run between wickets, or drs.

I'm ok if they lose in 3 days. That would be a step towards progress if it meant facing up to their fixable flaws.

I invested too much hope in this generation, I am now very bitter.
 

Bahnz

Hall of Fame Member
Big question, if Boult is unavailable, do New Zealand call up Kugz? Can't be denied that he's been the form bowler in domestix for the past couple seasons, and he'd add some backbone to our lower order.
 

RxGM

U19 Vice-Captain
Big question, if Boult is unavailable, do New Zealand call up Kugz? Can't be denied that he's been the form bowler in domestix for the past couple seasons, and he'd add some backbone to our lower order.
From a media perspective I would expect them to debut Kugz overseas/hidden in the rugby season. Will be a ****storm if he was to be selected now, and an absolute distraction to the team.
 

Top