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*Official* Netherlands vs Spain (World Cup Final)

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That's pathetic, giving a goal kick instead of a corner is a tiny and insignificant decision that has no bearing on the game. You can trace any goal back to a throw-in that should have gone the other way or a borderline free-kick. If Holland hadn't spontaneously decided to defend like spanners for the last five minutes no one would be talking about such minor calls. I thought he did a good job too, in one of the most difficult matches to referee of all time.
 

duffer

Hall of Fame Member
Nah you're taking what I'm saying into a different direction as I expected. Essien is class at what he does, same as Lampard is. As such it'd be hard to say who's the better player. Ferdinand's a better player than Eduardo and we're not comparing positions there but how good they are relative to it.
There's no clear seperation between Lampard and Essien sure. There is however between Cesc and Iniesta imo and most definitely between Cesc and Busquets which is why what you said was invalid.
 

roseboy64

Cricket Web Content Updater
There's no clear seperation between Lampard and Essien sure. There is however between Cesc and Iniesta imo and most definitely between Cesc and Busquets which is why what you said was invalid.
If you want to go down that road......Iniesta>Cesc>Busquets

Who I would leave out in Barca's usual formation though?

Villa Ibra Messi

Iniesta

Busquets Xavi
 

GIMH

Norwood's on Fire
However insignificant a goal-kick decision is (and generally I'd agree although the timing was unfortunate) it was still an appalling decision, simply inexcusable.

The Iniesta thing, dunno, seen it given but not enough to cry injustice.

I think Spain were a little dirtier than they've been given credit for because the Dutch were such animals but the best team won and not because of the referee.
 

vcs

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If you want to go down that road......Iniesta>Cesc>Busquets

Who I would leave out in Barca's usual formation though?

Villa Ibra Messi

Iniesta

Busquets Xavi
Nah. First, they aren't directly comparable, Cesc and Xavi are. But if you insist on doing it, Cesc's end-product is better than Iniesta's, though the latter has been much better in the big matches. And no, I don't buy the "Iniesta would be better if he was fit" excuse because staying fit is part of the deal.
 

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I wouldn't say Cesc and Xavi are directly comparable. Xavi plays much, much deeper. Cesc is somewhere between Xavi and Iniesta. Xavi is somewhere between Cesc and Alonso.
 

vcs

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I wouldn't say Cesc and Xavi are directly comparable. Xavi plays much, much deeper. Cesc is somewhere between Xavi and Iniesta. Xavi is somewhere between Cesc and Alonso.
True, that's why I have no reservations about saying Xavi>Cesc even though Cesc scores plenty more goals. In fact, there is no other player in world football who can control games anywhere near as well as Xavi does. But Cesc's style of play is pretty similar to Xavi, and he used to play a bit deeper for Arsenal a couple of years back.
 

roseboy64

Cricket Web Content Updater
Nah. First, they aren't directly comparable, Cesc and Xavi are. But if you insist on doing it, Cesc's end-product is better than Iniesta's, though the latter has been much better in the big matches. And no, I don't buy the "Iniesta would be better if he was fit" excuse because staying fit is part of the deal.
Those were the three players mentioned as we had agreed Xavi was the best of those named so hence the comparison.
 

Lillian Thomson

International Coach
Does when they go straight up the other end and score tbh.
The point is that they had time to regroup and render that mistake of little importance. If Spain had broken away and scored as the result of an error that would be different. No team at that level is going to concede a goal straight from a goalkick............................
 

Matteh

Cricket Web: All-Time Legend
Has happened though, believe it was Kuzuscak (spelling etc.) who let it in for Poland.
 

sledger

Spanish_Vicente
Believe what LT was alluding to is the fact that England conceded more or less straight from a goal kick against Germany.
 

Ikki

Hall of Fame Member
That's pathetic, giving a goal kick instead of a corner is a tiny and insignificant decision that has no bearing on the game. You can trace any goal back to a throw-in that should have gone the other way or a borderline free-kick. If Holland hadn't spontaneously decided to defend like spanners for the last five minutes no one would be talking about such minor calls. I thought he did a good job too, in one of the most difficult matches to referee of all time.
Didn't they score on the counter where the ref should have called the Elija foul?

Well if I'm right about the immediate dismissal guidelines, he only really had two options- red card+immediate free kick, or nothing at all. Given that Robben stayed on his feet, it's reasonable to assume he'd have preferred the latter, so that's what Webb gave him. That seems like common sense to me.

Seriously tough spot to make a decision, in any case. As I mentioned before, the ref who sent Lehmann off in the Arsenal-Barca cup final came under even more criticism than Webb has. Damned if you do...
I may have missed something, but what about Webb playing advantage and then giving Puyol his second yellow at the first break of play?
 
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Lillian Thomson

International Coach
I may have missed something, but what about Webb playing advantage and then giving Puyol his second yellow at the first break of play?
Waiting for a natural break in play is dangerous for a referee in a potential sending off situation because the offender could contribute greatly to the game and even score a goal before a break occurs. If he's going to do anything he should see if there's an advantage and if there isn't stop play the instant it becomes obvious that there is no advantage.
 

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