***Official*** India in New Zealand 2020

[Slifer]

As a neutral I dont see what all the fuss is about. NZ deserve to be where they are at for playing solid cricket. Kudos to them for beating a very strong Indian team. All the top teams face weak opponents at some point , just the nature of the schedule. What I'm curious about is if India and Pakistan will contest another test series in my life time...

 

[Kirkut]

I see a thrashing in Australia in the coming December, Pujara saved us last time and though they had a full strength pace attack their bowlers were not bowling to full potential. I'm certain our pace bowlers will do very well but batting will suffer. Strange times, when was the last time an Indian fan would have had more faith in their bowling attack than their batting line up?

 

[Nintendo]

I see a thrashing in Australia in the coming December, Pujara saved us last time and though they had a full strength pace attack their bowlers were not bowling to full potential. I'm certain our pace bowlers will do very well but batting will suffer. Strange times, when was the last time an Indian fan would have had more faith in their bowling attack than their batting line up?

Tbf Aus bowled to there absolute best in the first 2 tests aside from starc, was only the 3rd test where they started going off.

 

[Daemon]

Yeah they were still very good, but Haze and Starc went off the boil after Pujara drained them of their will to live.

We’re definitely in for a bollocking the way our batting is going now.

 

[Nintendo]

Yeah that first innings of the first test where India declared on 488/8 was the end of the line for Aus, our bowling went off a cliff after that. I expect a huge series for kohli when he comes to Aus in December, has still only 31 and never struck me as the type to take a series like nz lightly, and he has 9 months off test to figure himself out. Kohli to come back with a vengeance, 600+ runs and 2 tons.

 

[Daemon]

I would look at the NZ and Aus series in isolation for Kohli. He's always had more of a weakness to the moving ball (Eng/NZ) as opposed to bounce (Aus/SA). Even when he had a good tour of England the last time round, it could have easily gone **** up if he nicked 1-2 of the million times Anderson beat his bat.

In Australia I think he'll be good. I'm more worried about the rest.

 

[honestbharani]

SA swung all over the place in 2018. Just saying.

 

[Daemon]

SA swung all over the place in 2018. Just saying.

True. There was weird bounce and seam on offer too, no idea how Kohli and AB scored runs on that tour.

But iirc Cape Town swung the most and Kohli didn't do well. I can't really recall how it behaved in the next two tests but I think the 2nd test didn't have as much swing on offer (which is where they stupidly dropped Bhuvi).

 

[vcs]

Think the best Kohli has batted in such conditions was in 2013 Jo'burg where he faced peak Steyn, Philander and Morkel. It was pretty spicy on day 1 though it did flatten out as it went on.

 

[Daemon]

Was that the Kohli-Pujara partnership? So good.

 

[Nintendo]

Was that the Kohli-Pujara partnership? So good.

Yeah it was

 

[honestbharani]

True. There was weird bounce and seam on offer too, no idea how Kohli and AB scored runs on that tour.

But iirc Cape Town swung the most and Kohli didn't do well. I can't really recall how it behaved in the next two tests but I think the 2nd test didn't have as much swing on offer (which is where they stupidly dropped Bhuvi).

Yeah, was beaten by Philander's inseamer much the same as he was beaten here by CdG's. When a pitch is offering seam movement and you get a bowler who can swing it, its always better to play the ball off the pitch. Think both times Kohli fell because he was trying to pre-empt his position based on the swing alone. Was a sitting duck once the ball jagged back in. In England, it was mostly all swing and very little seam so he was able to do it better, I think.

In general, our batsmen seem to be coached to look for the swing off the hand and get in position accordingly. So in classic swing bowling conditions, we may still do well but if the pitch offers reasonable seam movement, we are gone.

 

[TheJediBrah]

Yeah, was beaten by Philander's inseamer much the same as he was beaten here by CdG's. When a pitch is offering seam movement and you get a bowler who can swing it, its always better to play the ball off the pitch. Think both times Kohli fell because he was trying to pre-empt his position based on the swing alone. Was a sitting duck once the ball jagged back in. In England, it was mostly all swing and very little seam so he was able to do it better, I think.

In general, our batsmen seem to be coached to look for the swing off the hand and get in position accordingly. So in classic swing bowling conditions, we may still do well but if the pitch offers reasonable seam movement, we are gone.

That's how you play at the top level, and even a lot of lower levels. You can't be playing 130k+ bowlers off the pitch lol. Sure you can sometimes make quick minor adjustments if you're defending but generally you have to assume that the ball is not going to deviate off the pitch and if it does you hope for the best

then again you are talking about Philander and CdG who aren't exactly express so it may be a fair point

 

[honestbharani]

I am just saying you can prepare without committing to that extent. The best players always have the ability to play the ball late, and I am sure Virat has that to spare. Its just that he is locking himself up the moment he sees some swing in the air for the bowler, especially a pre-dominantly outswing bowler. He could give himself a little more time is what I mean. Its hard to explain but when you are batting you kinda know when you are committing a bit too early to the ball.

 

[TheJediBrah]

Nah I agree with you, personally I think that was where a lot of his knicking outside off issues came from a few years ago too

 

[honestbharani]

Yep.. and this is a kind of an overcorrection from him towards that problem. But he usually works stuff pretty quickly and it was just a two test series. He is the least of the worries from the Indian batting perspective. I kinda think Rohit will go well in Australia too, even at the top of the order. Hopefully Pujara can retain his form. Rahane is my real worry. He has just a lot of his batting effectiveness and is kinda getting himself no man's land scores at best.

 

[vcs]

Rahane batted well in WI and in the home season. Trouble is, India were so dominant at home and the conditions are so drastically different that runs made there are hardly an indicator of how someone will go in a tough situation overseas.

 

[honestbharani]

Its not so much about the runs. You just look at him today and compare him to the guy who scored tough runs for fun in 2014-2017. He tried to do something about his batting to get back into the LO set up and I fear it might have impacted his long form game forever. Right now when you watch him bat, he seems clueless on how to construct his innings. He always had a template before that, a very free scoring albeit risky start and then settling down for long innings. Just not happening with him right now.

 

[Burgey]

Good one fuller pitch. Our batting has improved a lot recently and we’d give you a good match on bowler friendly pitches. Can’t wait till you tour England, although you did well here in 2015.

Has it though?

 

[Burgey]

I would look at the NZ and Aus series in isolation for Kohli. He's always had more of a weakness to the moving ball (Eng/NZ) as opposed to bounce (Aus/SA). Even when he had a good tour of England the last time round, it could have easily gone **** up if he nicked 1-2 of the million times Anderson beat his bat.

In Australia I think he'll be good. I'm more worried about the rest.

I think it’s a given he’ll be at worst good/ very good in Australia - He likes the conditions here and has done well before. It’s the greatest country on earth with the best people and richest cricket history on the planet. So why wouldn’t he?

Pujara will be the key to the whole thing again though. It’s likely we’ll have more than 180-220 to play with most of the time, so he’ll be vital. Not sold on Sharma opening out here - think he’ll struggle because our attack is relentless and gets awkward bounce. My views on Rahane are well known - generally does his best work out here when it doesn’t matter. So if Pujara goes early it’s a real problem for you blokes imo.

Anyway, good series to look forward to. Shall see how it goes, assuming it goes ahead given Covid19.