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New Zealand in Pakistan

Athlai

Not Terrible
Seems very unlikely that the NZ government won't be able to supply reasonable justification to the ICC when the time comes.
 

Prince EWS

Global Moderator
It's hard to understand because NZC and NZ government has shown zero inclination to share the nature and details of the threat.
I don't think they should have to.

I'd maybe expect something if it felt like a total dodge - like if they hadn't left yet and smelt of "cbf". But they were already there. It made more sense for them to play it than not at that stage unless they're being truthful about the threat. They might not trust the PCB or the Pakistan Government with the intel they had.

I think it's a very different situation to "our coach is sick", which is what people tried to compare it to earlier in the thread.
 
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nzfan

International Vice-Captain
Of course it's disappointing as a cricket fan we couldn't get to watch our young team play in Pakistan. Surely we were keen to watch that. I was keenly looking forward to some decent quality cricket from both sides with good talents but then cricket takes back seat if there's any threat. It's a threat to innocent pakistan public too. If the threat was directed at the team that'll have affected the pakistan public too. There would have been young kids, families out there attending wanting to enjoy cricket and if there was anything untoward at the ground it would have been a disaster. I guess in the long run I'm sure we will appreciate the outcome may have been for the best even though it feels like pakistan got a raw deal. Not the end of the world. I know for sure cricket will return to Pakistan and they'll be a force to reckon in world cricket. Matter of time.
 
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Athlai

Not Terrible
I mean the genuine difference of opinion here might be - we both agree there is a credible threat but Pakistan feel they can handle it and NZ feel that any credible threat is too great a risk to begin with.
 

nzfan

International Vice-Captain
It's hard to understand because NZC and NZ government has shown zero inclination to share the nature and details of the threat.
I guess in time it will be revealed. Matter of time. Honestly our govt is not that terrible to cause unnecessary stress to Pakistan using cricket as a tool deliberately. We wouldn't have sent our team in the first place but then the security status would have changed to take the decision they did. It's the same folks that approved the tour and got our guys to travel there. If they had a change of mind I'm certain it must have been for a very solid reason.
 
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nzfan

International Vice-Captain
I mean the genuine difference of opinion here might be - we both agree there is a credible threat but Pakistan feel they can handle it and NZ feel that any credible threat is too great a risk to begin with.
That pretty much sums it up. I guess pakistan feels it's safe even if there was a threat and we think otherwise. Pakistan may feel they could have handled the threat and our govt would have felt if things went wrong there'll be outrage having ignored the threat.

Even if the threat is revealed both parties may continue to view it with the same perspective they have right now. No way out of it I feel and could only be solved by dialogue.

Still appreciate pakistan doing everything under their control to provide the kind of security they gave to our players so far.
 

tsp_207

Cricket Spectator
It's possible that the NZ government might have intel that the threat was somehow supported or even planned by someone inside the Pakistani security detail, military or government. Might explain their reluctance to share info with PCB and the Pakistani authorities until their players are safe and sound on a flight back home.
 

sunilz

International Debutant
Noone should inform anything to PCB, Pakistan government considering their open support to Taliban, Al Qaeda .
 

nzfan

International Vice-Captain
I think the security is pretty tight, no doubt about that otherwise we wouldn't have sent our players. They scan every possible area, secure drop off and pick up, road blockades etc but despite that and reviewing it our security team would have felt there was still a strong chance things could go wrong. Otherwise no one takes a decision like we did. In fact from what I have come to understand the threat was recognized at least 12-15 hours prior. It just took too long to convey to the public due to trying to solve the issue diplomatically. If it took two PMs to discuss the matter then threat had to be real. No one rings up PM for petty matters. There are escalations in place and if it was escalated up to the PM level which is the highest in our country we can clearly assume the matter was serious. I think the outcome is good for both parties even though it may not be appreciated by pakistan right now.
 

AndyZaltzHair

International Coach
The way Pakistan reacted to this esp the fool that is Ramiz Raza, they seem to be forgetting that NZ agreed to come to Pakistan and they even landed in the country.
 

Flem274*

123/5
It's possible that the NZ government might have intel that the threat was somehow supported or even planned by someone inside the Pakistani security detail, military or government. Might explain their reluctance to share info with PCB and the Pakistani authorities until their players are safe and sound on a flight back home.
Yea no ones said it yet but if theyre not talking to ISI or pakistan gov then its pretty evident 5 eyes think pakistan has a traitor in the security
 

AndyZaltzHair

International Coach
It does not matter whatever security Pakistan provides, if NZ Gov/NZC assessed they shouldn’t be playing then they have 100% rights to pull out.
 

Apex Predator

State Vice-Captain
Assuming you are an Indian, there's no need for you to pretend like the Five Eyes and Multiple Anus Alliance is some impregnable and divine clause that allows NZ to bail out on tours without any justification.
Nothing about Indian or Pakistani here as these are basic simple facts that people & higher ups authorities in Pakistan are well aware about. These jingoistic statements by Pakistani ex players is only making Pakistan look bad. PM Imran Khan & NZ PM had a talk about it & she was in no position to continue as she had the specific western intel. NZC is just obeying the orders. It's an unfortunate situation but it is what it is.
 

nzfan

International Vice-Captain
That said ex Pakistan players and other responsible people in Pakistan aren't doing a good job with this. They're trying to convince their public NZ is **** and sold to some western agenda. That's a very bad way to paint us. Nzc and our players social media is filled with venom and abuses directed towards our nation, cricket and even players who had nothing to do with the decision. I can see some of our players closing down their social media accounts. Their family's social media are being targeted. This is due to the garbage being spread. This being fuelled by irresponsible statements by past players, ministries, media is not a mature way to go about. Just goes on to show how an event like this causes so much hatred. I can't see any of our players seeing pakistan as reasonable. Next time Pakistan is spoken deep inside they'll know it's not a topic they will endear to.
 

AndyZaltzHair

International Coach
That said ex Pakistan players and other responsible people in Pakistan aren't doing a good job with this. They're trying to convince their public NZ is **** and sold to some western agenda. That's a very bad way to paint us. Nzc and our players social media is filled with venom and abuses directed towards our nation, cricket and even players who had nothing to do with the decision. I can see some of our players closing down their social media accounts. Their family's social media are being targeted. This is due to the garbage being spread. This being fuelled by irresponsible statements by past players, ministries, media is not a mature way to go about. Just goes on to show how an event like this causes so much hatred. I can't see any of our players seeing pakistan as reasonable. Next time Pakistan is spoken deep inside they'll know it's not a topic they will endear to.
I’m sure any sensible person won’t fall for this.
 

nzfan

International Vice-Captain
I’m sure any sensible person won’t fall for this.
I hope not but you know players are humans after all. They hurt too. They will be going through a lot right now. In the end no matter who did what it's the players that'll suffer. The politicians, media, even public will move on but the players will be targeted unnecessarily. Already they'll be under enough stress with covid etc more the media, public hounds them. They weren't even part of decision making I guess in this issue.

I can see some early retirements and ben stokes like situations coming up in our camp.
 

Apex Predator

State Vice-Captain
I hope not but you know players are humans after all. They hurt too. They will be going through a lot right now. In the end no matter who did what it's the players that'll suffer. The politicians, media, even public will move on but the players will be targeted unnecessarily. Already they'll be under enough stress with covid etc more the media, public hounds them. They weren't even part of decision making I guess in this issue.

I can see some early retirements and ben stokes like situations coming up in our camp.
I am sure they are not that soft. They might not want to visit Pakistan in future but they are professional cricketers & must have some sort of mental toughness to deal with these things.
 

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