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Jacques Kallis vs Imran Khan

Better cricketer ?

  • Kallis

    Votes: 17 27.9%

  • Imran

    Votes: 44 72.1%
  • Total voters
    61
h_hurricane

h_hurricane

International Vice-Captain
On the topic of who is the best ever, Sobers, Imran, Kallis and Miller are generally regarded as the 4 greatest all rounders ever.

Here are some stats which give some interesting insights. Stats without context admittedly.

Batting average to bowling average ratio

Sobers - 1.6979
Kallis - 1.6959
Imran - 1.6523
Miller - 1.6095

Runs per match * wickets per match

Sobers - 218.23
Imran - 177.96
Miller - 166.23
Kallis - 140.82

Sobers is regarded by most as the best allrounder is history for a good reason. He didn't just had a great gap between batting and bowling averages, he also impacted matches to a higher degree than others with more runs and wickets at the quality we are talking here.

I would go with Sobers > Imran > Kallis > Miller.
 
S

subshakerz

International Coach
h_hurricane said:
On the topic of who is the best ever, Sobers, Imran, Kallis and Miller are generally regarded as the 4 greatest all rounders ever.

Here are some stats which give some interesting insights. Stats without context admittedly.

Batting average to bowling average ratio

Sobers - 1.6979
Kallis - 1.6959
Imran - 1.6523
Miller - 1.6095

Runs per match * wickets per match

Sobers - 218.23
Imran - 177.96
Miller - 166.23
Kallis - 140.82

Sobers is regarded by most as the best allrounder is history for a good reason. He didn't just had a great gap between batting and bowling averages, he also impacted matches to a higher degree than others with more runs and wickets at the quality we are talking here.

I would go with Sobers > Imran > Kallis > Miller.
Click to expand...
I would also go with that ranking but not because of this statistical reasoning.

Both Sobers and Imran were top tier ATGs in one discipline and test class in their second. Miller and Kallis were a level below that status in bowling and batting respectively IMO.
 
Zinzan

Zinzan

Request Your Custom Title Now!
subshakerz said:
I would also go with that ranking but not because of this statistical reasoning.

Both Sobers and Imran were top tier ATGs in one discipline and test class in their second. Miller and Kallis were a level below that status in bowling and batting respectively IMO.
Click to expand...
Care to explain how Imran is a level above Miller when their records are basically the same except for the fact Miller lost around 6 years to the war?

Who knows what Miller's Test batting record would have ended up looking like and if not for those lost war years, considering he averaged close to 50 in FC cricket.
 
S

subshakerz

International Coach
Zinzan said:
Care to explain how Imran is a level above Miller when their records are basically the same except for the fact Miller lost around 6 years to the war?

Who knows what Miller's Test batting record would have ended up looking like and if not for those lost war years, considering he averaged close to 50 in FC cricket.
Click to expand...
Same averages doesnt mean same records. Imran's record as a bowler is that of a top tier ATG, Miller's is not, either in terms of wicket output, SR, etc. Which is why he was ranked outside the top 20 on CW's pace bowlers list.
 
Red_Ink_Squid

Red_Ink_Squid

Cricketer Of The Year
Zinzan said:
Care to explain how Imran is a level above Miller when their records are basically the same except for the fact Miller lost around 6 years to the war?

Who knows what Miller's Test batting record would have ended up looking like and if not for those lost war years, considering he averaged close to 50 in FC cricket.
Click to expand...
Miller not quite being in the top tier of ATG bowlers is fair. He was rarely the best bowler on his own team, let alone the world. His average is extremely good but his bowling workload was less than most greats (not unreasonable for an allrounder with back troubles) so he only took 3 wickets per Test. He'd generally bowl with the new ball but only sparingly otherwise. Lindwall and Bill Johnston were both taking more wickets than him playing in the same team. His bowling record doesn't stack up when compared with someone as incredible as Imran.
 
h_hurricane

h_hurricane

International Vice-Captain
subshakerz said:
Same averages doesnt mean same records. Imran's record as a bowler is that of a top tier ATG, Miller's is not, either in terms of wicket output, SR, etc. Which is why he was ranked outside the top 20 on CW's pace bowlers list.
Click to expand...
I would say Miller's SR of 60 something was a product of the times he was bowling. The best in the business were striking in the same ballpark. It is his wickets per match which is arguably shaky. I remember having some lengthy debates with TJB at some time on this topic. That said, he was pretty damn good against the opposition's best batsmen. Was involved in some great duels against Hutton.
Miller ahead of Kallis is not unreasonable. They are mighty close. Kallis having a much more fulfilling career swings it in his favor for me(though no fault of Miller).
 
S

subshakerz

International Coach
h_hurricane said:
I would say Miller's SR of 60 something was a product of the times he was bowling. The best in the business were striking in the same ballpark. It is his wickets per match which is arguably shaky. I remember having some lengthy debates with TJB at some time on this topic. That said, he was pretty damn good against the opposition's best batsmen. Was involved in some great duels against Hutton.
Miller ahead of Kallis is not unreasonable. They are mighty close. Kallis having a much more fulfilling career swings it in his favor for me(though no fault of Miller).
Click to expand...
I just wonder when posters try to compare Miller and Imran as bowlers if they really do rate Miller that highly or are just trying to knock Imran down a peg.
 
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